Floppy Usage

[jbrook]

Group,
I have someone who insists on telling me that only a percentage of his 3.5
floppy should be used. He recalls that some "experts" told him this 10
years ago. I say it's hogwash. Anybody have the straight scoop?

Thanks!
John

 

[Rod Speed]

Group,

You a groupy ? Or a gropey ?

I have someone who insists on telling me that only a percentage of his
3.5 floppy should be used. He recalls that some "experts" told him this
10 years ago. I say it's hogwash. Anybody have the straight scoop?

Yep, its mindlessly silly.

 

[Arno Wagner]

Group,
I have someone who insists on telling me that only a percentage of his 3.5
floppy should be used. He recalls that some "experts" told him this 10
years ago. I say it's hogwash. Anybody have the straight scoop?

What do you mean with "onky a percentage"? Do you mean it should
be filled up only to some degree? If so, that is nonsense.

Arno

 

[Joep]

I have someone who insists on telling me that only a percentage of his 3.5

floppy should be used. He recalls that some "experts" told him this 10
years ago. I say it's hogwash. Anybody have the straight scoop?

Probably a floppy manufacturer trying to increase his sales ...

 

[George E. Cawthon]

You a groupy ? Or a gropey ?


Yep, its mindlessly silly.

That was standard mantra several years ago. I do know that
there were some systems and programs that when saving a file
saved the update and then erased the old file. If the
floppy was so full that there wasn't enough room for the
update plus whatever else was on the floppy, it would start
the save but then fail. And then, people were constantly
taking the floppy out in the middle of a write operation
which screwed up everything, so it was kind of hard to tell
what the fault was. We had a secretary that constantly had
faults on floppys which were attributed to a failure of
hardware and resulted in several replacements of the floppy
drive. After several of those, we became pretty sure that
her floppy errors were due to operator error.

 

[Rod Speed]

That was standard mantra several years ago.
Nope.

I do know that there were some systems and programs that
when saving a file saved the update and then erased the old file.

Yep, thats the safe thing to do data wise.

If the floppy was so full that there wasn't enough
room for the update plus whatever else was on
the floppy, it would start the save but then fail.

That was always a possibility just when copying stuff to floppys.

And then, people were constantly taking the floppy
out in the middle of a write operation which screwed up
everything, so it was kind of hard to tell what the fault was.

Separate issue entirely to what was being discussed.

We had a secretary that constantly had faults on
floppys which were attributed to a failure of hardware
and resulted in several replacements of the floppy
drive. After several of those, we became pretty sure
that her floppy errors were due to operator error.

Sure, but again, a separate issue to what was being discussed.

 

[George E. Cawthon]

Yep, thats the safe thing to do data wise.


That was always a possibility just when copying stuff to floppys.


Separate issue entirely to what was being discussed.


Sure, but again, a separate issue to what was being discussed.

Well it was standard mantra back in the 286 and 386 days; it
was in manuals, it was in magazines, it was cautioned by
supposed computer guru's in businesses. I didn't say it was
true and don't know if it was ever true, but it was commonly
taught.

Sure those are separate issues, just a comment illustrating
why people often get strange ideas.

Now, maybe you can tell me why I have more failures with
resaving large files (about 3/4th of capacity) on floppys
that I ever had in the previous 15 or so years. I save a
backup file and when I go to use it the drive won't
recognize that disk, and there is no way to even format that
disk.

 

[Rod Speed]

Well it was standard mantra back in the 286 and 386 days;
Nope.

it was in manuals, it was in magazines,
Nope.

it was cautioned by supposed computer guru's in businesses.
Nope.

I didn't say it was true and don't know if it was ever true,

Corse it wasnt.

but it was commonly taught.
Nope.

Sure those are separate issues, just a comment
illustrating why people often get strange ideas.

Sure, but thats a separate issue to your mantra claim.

Now, maybe you can tell me why I have more failures
with resaving large files (about 3/4th of capacity) on
floppys that I ever had in the previous 15 or so years.

I dont believe you can demonstrate that has happened
as far as it having anything to do with the size of the file.

I save a backup file and when I go to use it the drive won't
recognize that disk, and there is no way to even format that disk.

If you cant format the floppy, thats normally because its
got physically damaged, in which case you can see that
physical damage by opening the shutter on the floppy, or
its seen a magnetisation that the head cant erase, normally
due to something magnetic external to the floppy diskette.

With that sort of magnetic problem, you should find that
the use of a bulk eraser allows it to be formatted again.
But bulk erasers arent that common anymore.

 

[George E. Cawthon]

Corse it wasnt.


Sure, but thats a separate issue to your mantra claim.

Doesn't make any difference how often you say Nope, the fact
remains that it was in the manuals.

I dont believe you can demonstrate that has happened
as far as it having anything to do with the size of the file.

Didn't say it had anything to do with file size just gave
the file size to indicate there was only one file.

If you cant format the floppy, thats normally because its
got physically damaged, in which case you can see that
physical damage by opening the shutter on the floppy, or
its seen a magnetisation that the head cant erase, normally
due to something magnetic external to the floppy diskette.

Nope. No physical damage. I've tested the effect magnets
on floppy disks. Run a magnet across a floppy and the old
systems could reformat the disk, run a magnet across a
floppy and the new systems won't see the disk. The same
disk that new systems would not recognize, could be put into
an old system and reformatted most of the time.

With that sort of magnetic problem, you should find that
the use of a bulk eraser allows it to be formatted again.
But bulk erasers arent that common anymore.

Nope. Run disks through a bulk eraser or use a wand type
demagnetizer and newer system drives won't or can't
recognize that disk. Don't know if that is due to the
physical drive or the software.

I'm very careful with my disks, so they don't get damaged
physically and they aren't subject to stray magnetic
sources. So, I doubt that disk failure is due to stray
magnetism.

 

[Rod Speed]

Rod Speed wrote

Doesn't make any difference how often you say
Nope, the fact remains that it was in the manuals.
Nope.

Didn't say it had anything to do with file size just
gave the file size to indicate there was only one file.

I dont believe you can demonstrate that has
happened as far as it having anything to do
with the amount of the diskette used.

Nope. No physical damage.

Then its gotta be the magnetic effect if you cant format it anymore.

I've tested the effect magnets on floppy disks.
Run a magnet across a floppy and the old systems
could reformat the disk, run a magnet across a
floppy and the new systems won't see the disk.

And thats your problem, the new systems dont have
enough flux density to override the effect of the magnet.

If you erase the diskette with a bulk eraser, they will format fine.

The same disk that new systems would not recognize, could
be put into an old system and reformatted most of the time.

See above.

Yep.

Run disks through a bulk eraser or use a wand type demagnetizer
and newer system drives won't or can't recognize that disk.
Bullshit.

Don't know if that is due to the
physical drive or the software.

Its just bullshit.

I'm very careful with my disks, so they don't get damaged
physically and they aren't subject to stray magnetic sources.

So its fairys at the bottom of the garden eh ?

Yeah, right.

So, I doubt that disk failure is due to stray magnetism.

Your problem.

In spades with that complete drivel about the amount of the
diskette used and your silly claim about what the manuals said.

 

[Salvatore]

What do you mean with "onky a percentage"? Do you mean it should
be filled up only to some degree? If so, that is nonsense.

Arno

Find a 286 with Dos 3.2

I always had disk failure with diskettes that were near full. After
deleting some files and adding others afterwards, Dos handled the file
management poorly and would fail the operation despite the adequate space
on the diskette.

I never saw it in a manual. It was simply a fact.

 

[Arno Wagner]

What do you mean with "onky a percentage"? Do you mean it should
be filled up only to some degree? If so, that is nonsense.

Arno

[/QUOTE]

Find a 286 with Dos 3.2

I always had disk failure with diskettes that were near full. After
deleting some files and adding others afterwards, Dos handled the file
management poorly and would fail the operation despite the adequate space
on the diskette.
I never saw it in a manual. It was simply a fact.

O.k., I had a 286 a long time ago. First I was using
Concurrent-DOS on iT (no problem with full disks),
later DR-DOS (also no problem with full disks).

Seems this is just another example for M$ incompetence...

Arno

 

[Amishman35]

Seems this is just another example for M$ incompetence...

My Sony VAIO computer running Windows XP is the first IBM compatible PC that
doesn't crash more often than once a week, even when using the Hibernate
function.

The Amiga I had almost never did the Guru.

 

[Arno Wagner]

My Sony VAIO computer running Windows XP is the first IBM compatible PC that
doesn't crash more often than once a week, even when using the Hibernate
function.

I have given up on MS. My Vaio runs Linux, as do my
other computers. I have not hane any random crashes
with Linux yet. There have been kernel releases that
are not reliable, e.g. the last stable 2.4.21 has
DMA trouble. But these are far and few in between.

The Amiga I had almost never did the Guru.

Neither did the ST I had. I am simply amazed every time
I see what kind of third rated OS and Software people
are willing to use.

Arno

 

[chrisv]

My Sony VAIO computer running Windows XP is the first IBM compatible PC that
doesn't crash more often than once a week, even when using the Hibernate
function.

The Amiga I had almost never did the Guru.

You obviously weren't a programmer. 8)