Fans - Why???

  • Thread starter Thread starter Bill White
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Bill White

In the past 14 years I've bought expensive HP and IBM PCs and I've bought
cheap Soyo and e-Machine PCs. I've built my own PCs from scratch and I've
bought 2nd hand PCs. Every PC I've ever bought has one thing in common. The
fans ALWAYS CRAP OUT WITHIN A YEAR OR TWO!!!

Can one of you hardware gurus tell me why? But, more importantly, and the
main reason for this post: Can someone give me the name of a super-reliable
fan manufacturer?

Much Thanks!
Bill White
 
Bill White said:
In the past 14 years I've bought expensive HP and IBM PCs and I've bought
cheap Soyo and e-Machine PCs. I've built my own PCs from scratch and I've
bought 2nd hand PCs. Every PC I've ever bought has one thing in common. The
fans ALWAYS CRAP OUT WITHIN A YEAR OR TWO!!!

Can one of you hardware gurus tell me why? But, more importantly, and the
main reason for this post: Can someone give me the name of a super-reliable
fan manufacturer?

Much Thanks!
Bill White
Click to expand...
Because the system builders were content to buy the cheapest fans available?
I've got systems that have been running 24X7 for seven years now that still
have the original fans operating quite well. I guess that I might have just
been especially lucky and that you've been just the opposite but I don't
scrimp on the fans for my systems and that surely has something to do with
their longevity.
 
In the past 14 years I've bought expensive HP and IBM PCs and I've bought
cheap Soyo and e-Machine PCs. I've built my own PCs from scratch and I've
bought 2nd hand PCs. Every PC I've ever bought has one thing in common. The
fans ALWAYS CRAP OUT WITHIN A YEAR OR TWO!!!

Can one of you hardware gurus tell me why? But, more importantly, and the
main reason for this post: Can someone give me the name of a super-reliable
fan manufacturer?

Much Thanks!
Bill White
Click to expand...


Choose thickest fan that wil fit in desired location, and lowest
RPM tolerable, leaving a little margin. Not only will this
increase lifespan but decrease noise and dust buildup.

Choose fans that are either very high quality sleeve bearing type
(Papst and Panaflo take top shelf, then Comair, Sunon, misc.
others less common), or _DUAL_ ball bearing. A label that reads
"ball bearing" is not an assurance of dual ball bearings. Ball
bearing fans are much better suited to highest heat environments
(like a power supply exhaust) or non-vertical orientation due to
preloading. Top name-brands for dual ball bearing fans include:

Papst, Panaflo (older, discontinued models), NMB, Nidec, Sanyo
(San Ace), Delta, among others.

If your systems are in an unusually hostile environment, it could
be helpful to provide air-conditioning, dust filtration, or
dehumidifier.

To promote longer lifespan of existing sleeve-bearing fans in
equipment, periodically lube then with high quality mid to heavy
weight oil, the more worn the fan the heavier weight it need be.
"Periodically" can vary, if it is needed more often than every
couple of years the fan ought to be replaced, which is still a
good alternative if fan had already worn enough to fail or start
making excess noise.

Occasionally a fan won't be balanced well, it can be wortwhile to
power fan before installing it, to see if it has excessive
vibration. Trying to balance a fan yourself is not recommended,
reject it, seeking refund of purchase price if possible (if fan
was purchased separately). This is more common, likely to be
necessary with cheap fans rather than the aforementioned brands.
 
Bill said:
In the past 14 years I've bought expensive HP and IBM PCs and I've
bought cheap Soyo and e-Machine PCs. I've built my own PCs from
scratch and I've bought 2nd hand PCs. Every PC I've ever bought
has one thing in common. The fans ALWAYS CRAP OUT WITHIN A YEAR
OR TWO!!!
Click to expand...

Because they are mechanical and have a built in wearout mechanism,
just as do hard drives. Both are guaranteed to fail, the only
question is when.
 
hmm.the only fan I can remember dying on me is one on the Northbridge of my
mobo. If your PC is always running or there's a lot of dust or smoke in the
air,fans won't live as long.
 
Bill said:
In the past 14 years I've bought expensive HP and IBM PCs and I've bought
cheap Soyo and e-Machine PCs. I've built my own PCs from scratch and I've
bought 2nd hand PCs. Every PC I've ever bought has one thing in common. The
fans ALWAYS CRAP OUT WITHIN A YEAR OR TWO!!!

Can one of you hardware gurus tell me why? But, more importantly, and the
main reason for this post: Can someone give me the name of a super-reliable
fan manufacturer?
Click to expand...

Are you a smoker?
 
Bill White said:
In the past 14 years I've bought expensive HP and IBM PCs and I've
bought cheap Soyo and e-Machine PCs. I've built my own PCs from
scratch and I've bought 2nd hand PCs. Every PC I've ever bought has
one thing in common. The fans ALWAYS CRAP OUT WITHIN A YEAR OR TWO!!!

Can one of you hardware gurus tell me why? But, more importantly, and
the main reason for this post: Can someone give me the name of a
super-reliable fan manufacturer?

Much Thanks!
Bill White
Click to expand...

Typically we find that fans start going bad or die in 3 years. That is,
we build some hosts for use in our lab and use new parts and either the
part dies from early infant death within 1 to 3 months or it lasts
forever (unless subject to later abuse which includes surges and
static), except for moving parts. In about 3 years, the case and power
supply fans often will start making noise or stop spinning but it
depends on the quality of the fan. They are mechanical devices so they
wear out, as will you CD tray, power button, hard and floppy drives, all
mice that use button switches, touchpads from abrasion. Better fans
cost more money.

I haven't used any of the fluid bearing ("hydro") fans yet to know how
they fare against double ball-bearing fans. All sleeve and ball-bearing
fans get noisier over time because of wear but I hear the fluid bearing
drives remain pretty constant, and I have to assume that less vibration
and less noise equates to less wear which equates to increased
longevity.
 
Thanks for the reply John. BTW, I love your website, especially the
biography. I found a lot of myself in the words :-)
 
Excellent Info!!!

Thanks so much for the detailed information. This was exactly what I was
hoping to see.

Bill White
 
Thanks a lot for the reply...

Very odd- I have had Maxtor drives that have failed probably more frequently
than the fans. But, for some wierd reason, it's never pissed me off as much
as when fans go. I guess I always expect the HD to go. Therefore, I've never
been caught without a good backup and a quick call to Maxtor replaces the
drive in a day or two.

Bill
 
Nope- that's a vice I've avoided :-)

You might have a point- I live in the country so it might be pollen.
Something to think about, although I would suspect that pollen is too small.

Thanks!

Bill
 
You know, you said something interesting. We do get a lot of power surges,
power outages, etc. here. And my PC is usually on as I'm a programmer. I
wonder if these cheap little fans can only take so many power zaps.

Thanks a lot for the reply and telling me about hydro fans- I think I'll do
some research on them.

Bill
 
In the past 14 years I've bought expensive HP and IBM PCs and I've bought
cheap Soyo and e-Machine PCs. I've built my own PCs from scratch and I've
bought 2nd hand PCs. Every PC I've ever bought has one thing in common.
The fans ALWAYS CRAP OUT WITHIN A YEAR OR TWO!!!

Can one of you hardware gurus tell me why? But, more importantly,
and the main reason for this post: Can someone give me the name
of a super-reliable fan manufacturer?
Click to expand...

I lube my fans with oil every year and they last forever.
Very simple to do. Some of my fans have working for 10 years
24/7 and still quite.
http://w1.857.telia.com/~u85710476/docs/image/example/fan01.jpg
http://w1.857.telia.com/~u85710476/docs/image/example/fan02.jpg
 
Every PC I've ever bought has one thing in common. The
fans ALWAYS CRAP OUT WITHIN A YEAR OR TWO!!!

Can one of you hardware gurus tell me why?
Click to expand...

preventing dust accumulation (intake filters), cleaning PC & fans once
a year & just once (when NEW!) greasing a bit fans bearings (under
brand sticker) with heavy Lithium grease (yes, the one for cars) but
not too much! the fans should last for years.
(I have in my machine almost all fans refurbished; the oldest one (NB)
is 8y old).
The approach was to clean them from dust, clean the bearing
with WD-40 & than before mounting them filling half of the hole
(max.2/3) under brand sticker with that grease! But have in mind that
generally greased fans will run around 10% slower long term
than same with oil-ed bearing or w/o it ...

This way you have also a "grease Thermo regulation" (-/+10%)
:-) . The grease makes a "film" on bearings to prevent wearout &
entering dust into bearings & doesn´t run away like oil likes to do!
The density of it depends on temperature, so with lower temps there
is lower RPMs & viceversa (when after few days grease properly spreads
inside) .. :-)

.... this way also already rattling fans stop rattling for sure! .. :-)
(took me long time to verify that & come to this
conclusions-reinventing hot water!)
 
Spajky said:
preventing dust accumulation (intake filters), cleaning PC & fans once
a year & just once (when NEW!) greasing a bit fans bearings (under
brand sticker) with heavy Lithium grease (yes, the one for cars) but
not too much! the fans should last for years.
(I have in my machine almost all fans refurbished; the oldest one (NB)
is 8y old).
The approach was to clean them from dust, clean the bearing
with WD-40 & than before mounting them filling half of the hole
(max.2/3) under brand sticker with that grease! But have in mind that
generally greased fans will run around 10% slower long term
than same with oil-ed bearing or w/o it ...

This way you have also a "grease Thermo regulation" (-/+10%)
:-) . The grease makes a "film" on bearings to prevent wearout &
entering dust into bearings & doesn´t run away like oil likes to do!
The density of it depends on temperature, so with lower temps there
is lower RPMs & viceversa (when after few days grease properly spreads
inside) .. :-)

... this way also already rattling fans stop rattling for sure! .. :-)
(took me long time to verify that & come to this
conclusions-reinventing hot water!)
Click to expand...

How do you get the grease into the bearing? All I have seen are sealed
types, with a metal shield to prevent the introduction of foreign
materials into the bearing surface area. Could you explain how it
"properly spreads inside".

Art Leonard
 
Bill said:
Nope- that's a vice I've avoided :-)

You might have a point- I live in the country so it might be pollen.
Something to think about, although I would suspect that pollen is too small.

Thanks!
Click to expand...

Good point. I was just going to bum a cigarette.
 
How do you get the grease into the bearing? All I have seen are sealed
types, with a metal shield to prevent the introduction of foreign
materials into the bearing surface area. Could you explain how it
"properly spreads inside".

Art Leonard
Click to expand...


He is referring to sleeve-bearing fans while you are describing
ball-bearings. Generally a ball-bearing isn't to be relubed, by
the time this seems necessary the balls are deformed and little
can be done but to keep fan spinning for a very short while in an
emergency.

However, it is possible to get grease into one, by either
pressure (plug hole in center of bearing and hold firmly against
nozzle of a grease gun) or at least a little bit by heating the
bearing while submerged in grease, then cooling it as much as
possible. Grease liquifies and air inside bearing expands when
heated, escaping, then contracts drawing in some grease.
However, neither of these are worthwhile attempts to rejuvenate a
small, typical PC fan's bearing(s), once a ball bearing is acting
poorly it's time to replace it, though at least with most
ball-bearings they'll be quite a bit louder for the last few
weeks or longer of their life, unlike a sleeve-bearing which may
seize when system is turned off & cooling down, so it's QUIET the
next time system is turned on with fan not spinnning.
 
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