Does Windows Format Really Format?

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I have re-installed Windows 98, Windows XP several times over the past 10
years. One thing I notice is if you re-install Windows, there is still data
left on the drive.

How do I know? Even though I do a "clean" install, Windows still knows
afterwards that it could not know unless the info was already on the drive
beforehand.

Examples: 1)Windows knows my surfing history.
2) Trial Software reports it's been installed before.

How doe Windows know this, if the drive is wiped clean?
 
Ray said:
I have re-installed Windows 98, Windows XP several times over the
past 10 years. One thing I notice is if you re-install Windows,
there is still data left on the drive.

How do I know? Even though I do a "clean" install, Windows still knows
afterwards that it could not know unless the info was already on the
drive beforehand.

Examples: 1)Windows knows my surfing history.
2) Trial Software reports it's been installed before.

How doe Windows know this, if the drive is wiped clean?


It doesn't. If that's what you are seeing, then you *did* not do a format
and clean installation.

This is how to do a format and clean installation. If it's not what you did
(for example because you ran the installation from within Windows rather
than booting from the CD), that's the reason:

Just boot from the Windows XP CD (change the BIOS boot order if necessary to
accomplish this) and follow the prompts for a clean installation (delete the
existing partition by pressing "D" when prompted, then create a new one).

You can find detailed instructions here:
http://michaelstevenstech.com/cleanxpinstall.html

or here http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org/how_do_i_install_windows_xp.htm

or here http://windowsxp.mvps.org/XPClean.htm
 
Ken Blake said:
It doesn't. If that's what you are seeing, then you *did* not do a format
and clean installation.

This is how to do a format and clean installation. If it's not what you did
(for example because you ran the installation from within Windows rather
than booting from the CD), that's the reason:

Just boot from the Windows XP CD (change the BIOS boot order if necessary to
accomplish this) and follow the prompts for a clean installation (delete the
existing partition by pressing "D" when prompted, then create a new one).

You can find detailed instructions here:
http://michaelstevenstech.com/cleanxpinstall.html

or here http://xphelpandsupport.mvps.org/how_do_i_install_windows_xp.htm

or here http://windowsxp.mvps.org/XPClean.htm

--
Ken Blake - Microsoft MVP Windows: Shell/User
Please reply to the newsgroup

or here http://www.webtree.ca/windowsxp/clean_install.htm

No. No. When I say a clean install, I mean a clean install. The Delete
Partition; the L key, the whole 9 yards. Booting from the CD, changing the
boot sequence, yeah I've done all that. But after I perform this "clean
install", Windows still knows my surfing history. Trial Software still knows
it's been installed before. Now, I do admit I have only performed this on OEM
Hard Drives. Is OEM relevant? I would not think so.
 
Ray said:
No. No. When I say a clean install, I mean a clean install. The Delete
Partition; the L key, the whole 9 yards. Booting from the CD,
changing the boot sequence, yeah I've done all that. But after I
perform this "clean install", Windows still knows my surfing history.
Trial Software still knows it's been installed before.


When you do a clean installation, *everything* on the drive is gone. There
is no way Windows can still know anything about what happened in its
previous incarnation. If it does, it's not possible that you actually did a
clean installation.

Now, I do
admit I have only performed this on OEM Hard Drives. Is OEM relevant?


No, it doesn't matter.
 
When you do a clean installation, *everything* on the drive is gone. There
is no way Windows can still know anything about what happened in its
previous incarnation. If it does, it's not possible that you actually did a
clean installation.


Is it possible that there could be some residual data left on the cache of
the processor and re-surface after a clean install?

If what you're saying is gospel, I must be going nuts.
 
Ray said:
Is it possible that there could be some residual data left on the
cache of the processor and re-surface after a clean install?


When you power off, anything like that is gone.

If what you're saying is gospel, I must be going nuts.


Sorry, but I don't see any way that what you're saying can make any sense. I
haven't watched you do the "clean" installation, and I'm not sure what you
did wrong, but it seems pretty clear that you must have made some mistake in
the process.
 
Ray said:
I have re-installed Windows 98, Windows XP several times over the past 10
years. One thing I notice is if you re-install Windows, there is still data
left on the drive.

How do I know? Even though I do a "clean" install, Windows still knows
afterwards that it could not know unless the info was already on the drive
beforehand.

Examples: 1)Windows knows my surfing history.
2) Trial Software reports it's been installed before.

How doe Windows know this, if the drive is wiped clean?


If the drive were really formatted, Windows wouldn't know this. What
are you doing that you're calling "formatting?"


--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:



They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -Benjamin Franklin

Many people would rather die than think; in fact, most do. -Bertrand Russell
 
If the drive were really formatted, Windows wouldn't know this. What
are you doing that you're calling "formatting?"
O.K. Let me tell you exactly what I did.

1) Change the boot sequence to the Master CD drive.

2) Boot the computer.

3) Press any key to boot from the CD....... (I press Enter)

4) Windows shows the License Agreement.. (I press (I forgot the key) to
agree)

5) Windows gives me the option to Fix an Installation or Install a Fresh Copy

6) I choose to Install a Fresh Copy.

7) Windows shows me the Partitions on my Computer.

8) I select the Partition that has the OS on it.

9) Windows warns me about it being a System partition.

10) I delete it anyways.

11) Now Windows shows me I have 1 partition.

12) I select that partition.

13) Windows give me the Option (Quick Format or Full (NTFS))
I DO NOT CHOOSE THE QUICK OPTION.

14) Windows proceeds to Format the Drive and Install the OS.

When I am done, as God as my witness, when I choose the dropdown at the top
of Internet Explorer there are sites listed there. Where did they come from?
How did Internet Explorer know I was at cnn.com before?

Also, If I try to Install Trial Software, the software reports it has been
installed before. How does it know it has been installed before.

Now, I am not the type to buy into conspiracy theories, but is it possible
that the Windows Formatting program is not really completely formatting the
drive? Is it possible that Microsoft and other "partners" are doing this so
Trial Software cannot be installed repeatedly simply by re-formatting the
drive? I don't know. I can only tell you what I have expereinced.
 
O.K. Let me tell you exactly what I did.

1) Change the boot sequence to the Master CD drive.

2) Boot the computer.

3) Press any key to boot from the CD....... (I press Enter)

4) Windows shows the License Agreement.. (I press (I forgot the key) to
agree)

5) Windows gives me the option to Fix an Installation or Install a Fresh Copy

6) I choose to Install a Fresh Copy.

7) Windows shows me the Partitions on my Computer.

8) I select the Partition that has the OS on it.

9) Windows warns me about it being a System partition.

10) I delete it anyways.

Really? Not if the following statement (11) is accurate.

11) Now Windows shows me I have 1 partition.

How could you have one partition after deleting it? You're doing
something wrong at this point and not truly deleting the partition.

12) I select that partition.

Which would not exist if you had truly deleted it and had not
subsequently created a new partition in the unallocated space.

13) Windows give me the Option (Quick Format or Full (NTFS))
I DO NOT CHOOSE THE QUICK OPTION.

Not a true format, then; merely erasing the FAT.

14) Windows proceeds to Format the Drive and Install the OS.

Are there no further error messages?

When I am done, as God as my witness, when I choose the dropdown at the top
of Internet Explorer there are sites listed there. Where did they come from?
How did Internet Explorer know I was at cnn.com before?

Also, If I try to Install Trial Software, the software reports it has been
installed before. How does it know it has been installed before.

Now, I am not the type to buy into conspiracy theories, but is it possible
that the Windows Formatting program is not really completely formatting the
drive? Is it possible that Microsoft and other "partners" are doing this so
Trial Software cannot be installed repeatedly simply by re-formatting the
drive? I don't know. I can only tell you what I have expereinced.


It sounds like you actually performing a repair installation.

--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:



They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -Benjamin Franklin

Many people would rather die than think; in fact, most do. -Bertrand Russell
 
I've had the same question after doing my last installation from the
disc. Next time I have to do a reinstall, I'm going to open in DOS
and use the format c command. (I never remember exactly what it
is.)

If you go to the PC Tools website, there's a free program you can
download called Boot and Nuke. I haven't tried it, but it's supposed
to bring you down to a squeaky clean slate.
 
When you do a clean installation, *everything* on the drive is gone.
There is no way Windows can still know anything about what happened
in its previous incarnation. If it does, it's not possible that you
actually did a clean installation.




No, it doesn't matter.

Or, he's using something other than an actual installation CD for the
"install" that contains data he thinks should be gone.

I had a guy come to me with something like that a few weeks ago; whatever
the heck he had for his "original" CD, well, it wasn't. :-() It was
something a 'friend' set up for him as a slipstream of some kind, but ... it
turned out to be pirated. Easy to tell; it had a paper label on it!

Regards,

Pop`
 
When you power off, anything like that is gone.




Sorry, but I don't see any way that what you're saying can make any
sense. I haven't watched you do the "clean" installation, and I'm not
sure what you did wrong, but it seems pretty clear that you must have
made some mistake in the process.

As in, perhaps not formatting/installing to the drive he thinks he's doing?
The OP should check for another set of XP installation on his other
partitions and drives maybe?

Regards,

Pop`
 
Ray said:
....

7) Windows shows me the Partitions on my Computer.

There it is: PartitionsS; multiple. There are multiple partitions to start
with if the syntax is correct.
8) I select the Partition that has the OS on it.

From more than one partition. How do you decide which partition has the OS
on it? What is its number? How many drives do you have? How many physical
hard drives? How many drive letters?
9) Windows warns me about it being a System partition.

10) I delete it anyways.

11) Now Windows shows me I have 1 partition.

OK; one partition is left: You had two to begin with then.
12) I select that partition.

13) Windows give me the Option (Quick Format or Full (NTFS))
I DO NOT CHOOSE THE QUICK OPTION.

14) Windows proceeds to Format the Drive and Install the OS.

Yes, but it's the WRONG drive. You deleted a partition, but you skipped a
step: You had to Recreate the partition you deleted, NOT use the remaining
partition, Plus it had to actually be THE partition the OS lived on that you
deleted. It doesn't sound like it was?
Without deleting that partition you deleted, you could not possibly
have installed the OS to it, since it was no longer there. You apparently
installed to a different partition somehow.
When I am done, as God as my witness, when I choose the dropdown at
the top of Internet Explorer there are sites listed there. Where did
they come from? How did Internet Explorer know I was at cnn.com
before?

Actually, that happens fairly often when people skip a step in the process
or get their one's and zero's mixed up in determining which drive/partition
holds their OS.
It would be a good idea here to list everything ver batum w/r to
drive/partition types and numbers to get one's head around tha actual
problem.

What happened to you would make sense.
Also, If I try to Install Trial Software, the software reports it has
been installed before. How does it know it has been installed before.

Now, I am not the type to buy into conspiracy theories, but is it
possible that the Windows Formatting program is not really completely
formatting the drive? Is it possible that Microsoft and other
"partners" are doing this so Trial Software cannot be installed
repeatedly simply by re-formatting the drive? I don't know. I can
only tell you what I have expereinced.

IFF (and I seriously doubt there is) a conspiracy like that, it would not be
anywhere near this easy to detect, given the power of MS <g>. It's not a
conspiracy; it's just confusion due to the excellent wording and phraseology
Microsoft uses and their lack of explanation of the operations to a
non-experienced user. IMO anyway. You have to very carefully watch and
read those first few screens and not gloss over or guess at anything. Been
there, done that.

First, positively ID the drive/partition the OS lives on with Adminstrative
Tools.
Then delete THAT partition.
Then recreate a partition in its place. To be certain, you would likely be
better off deleting ALL partitions on that hard drive so you only have the
one to recreate and work with, IF that could be feasible for you.

Regards,

Pop`
 
KIMOSABE said:
I've had the same question after doing my last installation from the
disc. Next time I have to do a reinstall, I'm going to open in DOS
and use the format c command. (I never remember exactly what it
is.)

If you go to the PC Tools website, there's a free program you can
download called Boot and Nuke. I haven't tried it, but it's supposed
to bring you down to a squeaky clean slate.

Ummm, you might want to approach that one carefully. It has some gotcha's
that can really byte you in the arse, especially if you have multiple types
of partitions.

Basically, I think it'd work as long as your setup is reasonably clean and
simple.

Pop`
 
KIMOSABE said:
I've had the same question after doing my last installation from the
disc. Next time I have to do a reinstall, I'm going to open in DOS
and use the format c command. (I never remember exactly what it
is.)


How do you plan to do that? There is no MS-DOS in WinXP.





--

Bruce Chambers

Help us help you:



They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary
safety deserve neither liberty nor safety. -Benjamin Franklin

Many people would rather die than think; in fact, most do. -Bertrand Russell
 
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