Defrag and a lot stays fragged

  • Thread starter Thread starter William B. Lurie
  • Start date Start date
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William B. Lurie

In the color-coded array describing what is and isn't
fragmented, even after defragging several times, of the
5 GB of stored files, maybe 1 GB or more stays red
(fragmented) as a sold block after it has finished.
Isn't there anything I can do, to defragment that
whole bunch of files? This is independent of the
green area, which I assume to be the SWAP file.
 
-----Original Message-----
In the color-coded array describing what is and isn't
fragmented, even after defragging several times, of the
5 GB of stored files, maybe 1 GB or more stays red
(fragmented) as a sold block after it has finished.
Isn't there anything I can do, to defragment that
whole bunch of files? This is independent of the
green area, which I assume to be the SWAP file.
Click to expand...

Of course you don't say what defrag program you're using,
or why this is a problem for you. If you start up your
computer and go looking for things to mess with without
knowing wtf you're doing (and you seem to do that a lot)
you will most assuredly come to grief. If it's not causing
a problem, or threatening to, leave it alone!

Your Pal,

Phil
 
Phil said:
Of course you don't say what defrag program you're using,
or why this is a problem for you. If you start up your
computer and go looking for things to mess with without
knowing wtf you're doing (and you seem to do that a lot)
you will most assuredly come to grief. If it's not causing
a problem, or threatening to, leave it alone!

Your Pal,

Phil
Click to expand...

Phil, with frinds like you, I don't need enemies.
I use the defragger that is a System Tool under Accessories
in XP. Defragging is generally recommended as a tool for
keeping hard drive arm movements to a minimum, in the
interest of efficiency and wear. But you already knew that.

William B. Lurie
 
In the color-coded array describing what is and isn't
fragmented, even after defragging several times, of the
5 GB of stored files, maybe 1 GB or more stays red
(fragmented) as a sold block after it has finished.
Isn't there anything I can do, to defragment that
whole bunch of files? This is independent of the
green area, which I assume to be the SWAP file.
Click to expand...

This is normal especially when defragging from within the operating system
as some files will always be in use. Those files will not/cannot be
defragmented. If you run defrag a second time, some of the file handles
will have been closed and you'll find that a few more files were processed
than at the last run. However, you will never get all of them as there will
always be some in use and they are "untouchable" in that state.
 
-----Original Message-----


Phil, with frinds like you, I don't need enemies.
I use the defragger that is a System Tool under Accessories
in XP. Defragging is generally recommended as a tool for
keeping hard drive arm movements to a minimum, in the
interest of efficiency and wear. But you already knew that.

William B. Lurie
.
Click to expand...

If you could lead me to some reliable, empirical evidence
that defragging contributes in any fashion to hard drive
life, please do. But before you go searching, I can save
you some time: there ain't any. There isn't even any
consistently convincing evidence that file fragmentation
*necessarily* leads to performance problems. If you're
having performance problems, and defragging seems to help,
then go for it. But there is just no good reason to do it
unless there's a good reason to do it.

As an aside, if you're concerned about "hard drive arm
movements" it seems that defragging would be the *last*
thing you'd want to do. There's more head movement in 10
minutes of defragging than there is in a month of normal
use.
 
Sharon said:
This is normal especially when defragging from within the operating system
as some files will always be in use. Those files will not/cannot be
defragmented. If you run defrag a second time, some of the file handles
will have been closed and you'll find that a few more files were processed
than at the last run. However, you will never get all of them as there will
always be some in use and they are "untouchable" in that state.
Click to expand...
Good point, Sharon. But I've been using the built-in defrag
frequently, and it suddenly became a bold red 20% of the
stored files. Might be interesting to defrag on a partition
not in use. Thank you.
 
Billy Lurie: Get a life and stop trying to stir things up with your retarded posts every day
 
The said:
Well Phil as you seem to be a major a-hole I doubt that any reasoning with you would have any affect. Fragmentation does lead to system instability and greatly reduces the efficiency of I\O operations. A simple explanation for a simply mind like yours would be this. Take a book and rip out all the pages. Throw them about the room. Now try and read the book. Takes longer to find the next page doesn't it? Difficult? Defrag puts the book back together with the pages in order and results in an easy reading operation. Phil you are some putz. Good luck
Click to expand...
Thank you, friend. I didn't waste my time trying to
appease somebody who already knew everything.
 
I'm no friend of Phil's, but if you go to this site often Unknown P, you'd know that William B Lurie is the real putz. Constantly posting questions and then he disagrees or argues with every reply. Go back to your Dungeons and Dragons, dork.
 
Good point, Sharon. But I've been using the built-in defrag
frequently, and it suddenly became a bold red 20% of the
stored files. Might be interesting to defrag on a partition
not in use. Thank you.
Click to expand...

Was this the drive that you just restored? If yes, it could explain the
fragmentation and will eventually diminish. Or did you recently disable
hibernation to rid the drive of the hiberfil.sys file to create the image?
Move the swapfile? Or dump a bunch of restore points all at once?

If you use Analyze and then View Report what percentage does it show
"volume fragmentation > file fragmentation"?

If it's too high for your comfort level, move the pagefile to another
drive. Defrag. Then move it back.
 
-----Original Message-----
Well Phil as you seem to be a major a-hole I doubt that
Click to expand...
any reasoning with you would have any affect.
Fragmentation does lead to system instability and greatly
reduces the efficiency of I\O operations. A simple
explanation for a simply mind like yours would be this.
Take a book and rip out all the pages. Throw them about
the room. Now try and read the book. Takes longer to find
the next page doesn't it? Difficult? Defrag puts the book
back together with the pages in order and results in an
easy reading operation. Phil you are some putz. Good luck
.
Click to expand...

You are now in strong contention for stupid post of the
week, if not the month. Do you honestly believe that your
example is logically analogous? Please explain for my
"simply" mind how the speed at which one might try to
reassemble the book equates in real time to the motion of
the heads in a hard drive. Then, instead of your dumb
unsupported assertion, show me some real evidence that
regular defragging contributes favorably to overall PC
performance. As I suggested in my response to the idiot
OP, there may be some instances when defragging will help.
But in 2004 it just isn't necessary as a daily/weekly
maintenance task.
 
Why don't you show or tell us why defrag doesn't help or needn't be done
regularly? If the average seek time is 10 milli-seconds and 200 seeks are
required due to fragments how can you say saving those two seconds don't help?
 
-----Original Message-----
Why don't you show or tell us why defrag doesn't help or needn't be done
regularly? If the average seek time is 10 milli-seconds and 200 seeks are
required due to fragments how can you say saving those two seconds don't help?
Click to expand...

Before defragging can possibly do any good, the
fragmentation level has to be extreme. This means that on
an average-sized hard drive, you're going to defrag for
perhaps an hour or so--maybe less, maybe more--in order to
save two seconds 8 or 10 times an hour. Do the math,
pinhead.
 
In
Phil McCracken said:
Before defragging can possibly do any good, the
fragmentation level has to be extreme. This means that on
an average-sized hard drive, you're going to defrag for
perhaps an hour or so--maybe less, maybe more--in order to
save two seconds 8 or 10 times an hour.
Click to expand...


It's not usually quite that simple, in my view. Defragging can
often be done at night when the computer isn't in use anyway. So
a direct comparison of time saved vs. time taken to defrag isn't
usually meaningful.

That said, I agree that many people defrag much more often than
necessary. Certainly daily defragging is overkill, as is weekly
defragging for most people. How often to defrag depends on your
usage patterns, but every month or two is probably adequate for
most.
 
If you even WERE a pinhead you would know better.
Phil McCracken said:
Before defragging can possibly do any good, the
fragmentation level has to be extreme. This means that on
an average-sized hard drive, you're going to defrag for
perhaps an hour or so--maybe less, maybe more--in order to
save two seconds 8 or 10 times an hour. Do the math,
pinhead.
Click to expand...
 
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