Damage caused by wrong toner or wrong paper??

  • Thread starter Thread starter rainandsnow
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rainandsnow

I've had an OKI B4100 mono laser printer since new - 6 months ago.

It has started printing in very bad quality - faded, with thin vertical
stripes and is especiall faded towards the edges. Text is still readable but
if I try to print out a black page it looks awful - more white than black.

I refilled the toner recently - using some toner I had bought a while back
for a Samsung printer. Could that have done it?? I have noticed that the
test page mentions "microfine spherical toner for sharp detail" - does this
indicate that it needs different toner from the Samsung??

I tried to do a large batch of printing on 160 gsm card recently. (It was
cheap stuff and not specifically meant for laser printers but the Samsung
would have handled it ok). I was attempting to print on both sides - with
photo on one side. I tried for quite a while before I gave up and used
lighter paper. The toner was not bonding to the card as it should have and
was clearly coming off inside the printer and messing up the next print.)

Are either the toner or the card likely to have caused the quality problem
and if so, is there anything I can do???

(I've tried printing cleaning pages, cleaning the "LED array". The printer
indicates that there is 77% of drum life remaining)
 
rainandsnow said:
I've had an OKI B4100 mono laser printer since new - 6 months ago.

It has started printing in very bad quality - faded, with thin vertical
stripes and is especiall faded towards the edges. Text is still readable but
if I try to print out a black page it looks awful - more white than black.

I refilled the toner recently - using some toner I had bought a while back
for a Samsung printer. Could that have done it?? I have noticed that the
test page mentions "microfine spherical toner for sharp detail" - does this
indicate that it needs different toner from the Samsung??

I tried to do a large batch of printing on 160 gsm card recently. (It was
cheap stuff and not specifically meant for laser printers but the Samsung
would have handled it ok). I was attempting to print on both sides - with
photo on one side. I tried for quite a while before I gave up and used
lighter paper. The toner was not bonding to the card as it should have and
was clearly coming off inside the printer and messing up the next print.)

Are either the toner or the card likely to have caused the quality problem
and if so, is there anything I can do???

(I've tried printing cleaning pages, cleaning the "LED array". The printer
indicates that there is 77% of drum life remaining)
Click to expand...
I don't think the toner would have done it. If "microfine spherical
toner for sharp detail" is more than marketing, I'd just expect the text
to be a little more jaggy. With the thin vertical stripes, maybe the
drum is damaged? Toner not bonding, maybe fuser is defective?
 
rainandsnow said:
I've had an OKI B4100 mono laser printer since new - 6 months ago.

It has started printing in very bad quality - faded, with thin vertical
stripes and is especiall faded towards the edges. Text is still readable but
if I try to print out a black page it looks awful - more white than black.

I refilled the toner recently - using some toner I had bought a while back
for a Samsung printer. Could that have done it??
Yes.

I have noticed that the test page mentions "microfine spherical toner
for sharp detail" - does this indicate that it needs different toner
from the Samsung??
Click to expand...

Yes. For example:

http://www.theofficeguide.com/forum/Is_all_laser_toner_the_same?/m_96/tm.htm

If you're lucky, you haven't ruined the printer, and the messy and
potentially hazardous job of cleaning out the bad toner and replacing it
with a new cartridge with the right toner will allow the printer to work
again.

If you're not lucky, you might need a new drum, new fuser, or other
parts that cost more than the printer is worth.
 
If it has a 12mth warranty, that's where you start, try for a warranty replacement
or repair.
IMHO it sounds like the toner. Not fusing may mean it's not melting, that is
its melting point is incorrect. Plus it's obviously not being attracted to the
drum correctly, indicating its electrostatic properties aren't right for this
printer.
As your problems seem to have started with the refilling, you would need to
revert to an OEM cartridge to see if it resolves the problem.
I wouldn't rule out the card, but as it no longer prints on paper of suitable
thickness, it still points towards toner problems.
If it is the drum then it's probably cheaper to replace the printer than take
a chance on what might be an unsuccessful drum replacement that might
reveal another problem.
Try the manufacturer and warranty route, if you get a manufacturer
replacement printer, or service, it should have been serviced with OEM
parts, and meet the original specs.
If you end up by having to ship it for repair, remove the refilled cartridge
(since it has suspect non-OEM toner) saying you didn't ship the
cartridge because of the risk of toner spillage in transit.
 
If it has a 12mth warranty, that's where you start, try for a warranty
replacement
or repair.
IMHO it sounds like the toner. Not fusing may mean it's not melting, that
is
its melting point is incorrect. Plus it's obviously not being attracted to
the
drum correctly, indicating its electrostatic properties aren't right for
this
printer.
As your problems seem to have started with the refilling, you would need
to
revert to an OEM cartridge to see if it resolves the problem.
I wouldn't rule out the card, but as it no longer prints on paper of
suitable
thickness, it still points towards toner problems.
If it is the drum then it's probably cheaper to replace the printer than
take
a chance on what might be an unsuccessful drum replacement that might
reveal another problem.
Try the manufacturer and warranty route, if you get a manufacturer
replacement printer, or service, it should have been serviced with OEM
parts, and meet the original specs.
If you end up by having to ship it for repair, remove the refilled
cartridge
(since it has suspect non-OEM toner) saying you didn't ship the
cartridge because of the risk of toner spillage in transit.
Click to expand...

Thanks, but I'm not happy about doing that as I've probably ignored warnings
and it it probably my fault - and in addtions shipping would be expensive.
The drum looks OK - if that means anything so I'll probably try replacing
the toner.
 
Warren Block said:
Yes. For example:

http://www.theofficeguide.com/forum/Is_all_laser_toner_the_same?/m_96/tm.htm

If you're lucky, you haven't ruined the printer, and the messy and
potentially hazardous job of cleaning out the bad toner and replacing it
with a new cartridge with the right toner will allow the printer to work
again.

If you're not lucky, you might need a new drum, new fuser, or other
parts that cost more than the printer is worth.
Click to expand...

Yes, even just a new drum would cost more than the printer costs new. Based
on what you say here, I think I'll try replacing the toner - unless the
images (see below) make you review your opinion.

Here is a scan of the output - attempting to print a solid black page:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/axil99/
 
Toner formulations can vary considerably. They are typically made up of
a mixture of dye, pigments, waxes and plastic resins. Some contain
magnetic iron particles which are required in some designs.

It is always a "high risk" gamble when you use a non-designated toner.
There are literally hundreds on the market. They vary in melting/fusing
temperature, their static charge, how the adhere, and many other
characteristics.

Depending upon the printer, the wrong type can damage the optical drum,
the fuser, and other components. Cleanup can be difficult if the
printer uses special developers and the toner and developer mix.

Some types of wrong paper can damage a laser printer. If it is coated
paper and the melting temperature is low (especially if it is an inkjet
paper) it can melt onto and ruin the fuser area. If the paper is too
thick it can damage paper guides, transport or slip and cause scratching
on the optical drum, but most of the time toner not adhering well is not
enough tooth on the paper surface and it being too thick for the fuser
to heat it adequately.

You will probably need to remove the toner you installed, and clean the
printer well. You may need to replace the cleaning "felts" in the fuser
area.

Art
 
Thank you for taking responsibility for your own actions, rather than
trying to stick it to the manufacturer as was suggested. If we expect
manufacturers to be fair with us, we have to also be fair with them.

OKI-Data has a good reputation for treating customers fairly, and for
producing a quality product, and should not be abused for doing so.

It does should like a toner issue, which has nothing to do with the
product in all likelihood.

Art
 
rainandsnow said:
Yes, even just a new drum would cost more than the printer costs new. Based
on what you say here, I think I'll try replacing the toner - unless the
images (see below) make you review your opinion.

Here is a scan of the output - attempting to print a solid black page:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/axil99/
Click to expand...

Can't tell from that, but I've found lasers to be remarkably tough. The
B4100 looks to have an inexpensive toner-only cartridge, so it's
certainly worth a try.

There's bound to be loose bad toner in the printer; clean that out, but
avoid breathing any of it (don't use a vaccuum).

You may have to run several solid black pages of the good toner to get the
bad toner worked out.
 
Warren Block said:
Can't tell from that, but I've found lasers to be remarkably tough. The
B4100 looks to have an inexpensive toner-only cartridge, so it's
certainly worth a try.

There's bound to be loose bad toner in the printer; clean that out, but
avoid breathing any of it (don't use a vaccuum).

You may have to run several solid black pages of the good toner to get the
bad toner worked out.
Click to expand...

I would have tried hard not to breathe it, but thought Toner was relatively
harmless - is that wrong??
I've ordered a cartridge on Ebay - which is said to be compatible, and will
likely post back with results - if I survive emptying the old incorrect
toner out!

I'm delighted to hear there is room for optimism as I feared the worst, and
also pleased to hear that it is my fault really as I spent a good bit of
time choosing before I bought the OKI and it has been good up to now -
better than the two Samsungs I've had in most respects, but not quite as
good at monochrome photos.
 
rainandsnow said:
I would have tried hard not to breathe it, but thought Toner was relatively
harmless - is that wrong??
Click to expand...

Relatively harmless, although the carbon black in it is considered a
"potential" carcinogen. So limiting exposure to the ultra-fine dust is
a good idea.
I've ordered a cartridge on Ebay - which is said to be compatible, and will
likely post back with results - if I survive emptying the old incorrect
toner out!
Click to expand...

It'll probably work out. Even if it doesn't, post the results so
there'll be a record on Usenet.
 
Relatively harmless, although the carbon black in it is considered a
"potential" carcinogen. So limiting exposure to the ultra-fine dust is
a good idea.
Click to expand...

Work outside with the wind behind you, or use a desk fan
to blow the dust away from you.
There are also special dusters impregnated with a tacky
surface to pick up dust from surfaces (Takduster is
one brand name - used before painting) but don't use
them on drum, mirrors or other optical surfaces.
You may need to print 6 or more pages to get rid
of most of the incompatible toner.
 
Work outside with the wind behind you, or use a desk fan
to blow the dust away from you.
There are also special dusters impregnated with a tacky
surface to pick up dust from surfaces (Takduster is
one brand name - used before painting) but don't use
them on drum, mirrors or other optical surfaces.
You may need to print 6 or more pages to get rid
of most of the incompatible toner.
Click to expand...

Yes I thought I'd try outside and there is usually plenty of wind where I
live.

Strangely enough, the output from it doesn't look as bad as the dreadful
appearance of the "black" page would suggest. It is still readable and if I
can achieve a gradual improvement I will be happy. I've got a Canon IP4200 I
can use where I need good quality in the meantime. (I haven't tried
refilling that yet although it will shortly be necessary . . . I'll try not
to repeat my mistake)
 
I took a look at the image at Flicker, and normally I would say this is
due to very low toner left in the cartridge, or an improperly refilled one.

Are you sure you placed the toner in the correct location?

Another possibility, is if the toner requires is magnetic, and the stuff
you put in requires a separate developer, you might also get that kind
of output.

I am unfamiliar wit the specific printer, do you know if it has separate
drum, developer and toner, or what? Doe sit use a replaceable all in
one unit cartridge that replaces everything?

Art
 
As Warren states, most black toner uses carbon black as the main pigment
and it does have risks connected with it. More to the point, any fine
dust when breathed in is potentially dangerous in the lungs. If you
must breathe when handling this kind of fine dust, breathe through your
nose, and then blow your nose to remove as much as possible, which will
have clung to your sinus area.

It is one reason noses are damp, sticky and have hair inside.

Art
 
Arthur Entlich said:
I took a look at the image at Flicker, and normally I would say this is due
to very low toner left in the cartridge, or an improperly refilled one.
Click to expand...

scanner indicated low toner and I refilled cartridge. After refilling it
indicated full toner - menu page - 2.5k=100% or thereabouts.

Are you sure you placed the toner in the correct location?
Click to expand...

I put it in the toner cartridge

Another possibility, is if the toner requires is magnetic, and the stuff
you put in requires a separate developer, you might also get that kind of
output.

I am unfamiliar wit the specific printer, do you know if it has separate
drum, developer and toner, or what? Doe sit use a replaceable all in one
unit cartridge that replaces everything?
Click to expand...

I don't know. There is no replaceable developer as far as I know. The drum
and the bit which the cartidge feeds are all one unit.
 
Warren Block said:
Relatively harmless, although the carbon black in it is considered a
"potential" carcinogen. So limiting exposure to the ultra-fine dust is
a good idea.


It'll probably work out. Even if it doesn't, post the results so
there'll be a record on Usenet.
Click to expand...

The new (compatible) cartidge came today - less than 24 hrs after I ordered
it. I shook as much old toner as I could out of the drum etc assembly,
fitted the new cartridge and there is a considerable improvement - but still
a long way to go.

I've printed out 15 or so black pages and they are all the same - ie no
gradual improvement. The quality is not good enough for images, but looks
fine with text.

I hesitate to link to a scan as I didn't record the settings last time I
scanned and it can look all black or mostly white depending on settings. It
is similar to last time with a dark bit in the middle but the light bits
are now a good bit darker.

Thanks for your help.
 
measekite said:
The Lesson here is to always use the Factory Recommended Product.
Click to expand...

or perhaps to weigh up costs, risks and benefits and to reduce the risk by
not to making assumptions.
 
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www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.comnk.net said:
If it has a 12mth warranty, that's where you start, try for a warranty replacement
or repair.
IMHO it sounds like the toner. Not fusing may mean it's not melting, that is
its melting point is incorrect. Plus it's obviously not being attracted to the
drum correctly, indicating its electrostatic properties aren't right for this
printer.
As your problems seem to have started with the refilling, you would need to
revert to an OEM cartridge t www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
Click to expand...
(e-mail address removed) wrote: www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com
www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
o see if it resolves the problem.
I wouldn't rule out the card, but as it no longer prints on paper of suitable
thickness, it still points towards toner problems.
If it is the drum then it's probably cheaper to replace the printer than take
a chance on what might be an unsuccessful drum replacement that might
reveal another problem. www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
Click to expand...
(e-mail address removed) wrote: www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com
www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
Try the manufacturer and warranty route, if you get a manufacturer
replacement printer, or service, it should have been serviced with OEM
parts, and meet the orig www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
Click to expand...
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www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com
www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
inal specs.
If you end up by having to ship www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
Click to expand...
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it for repair, remove the refilled cartridge
(since it has suspect www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com
Click to expand...
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www.vmutah.com www.theshopatvmutah.com www.vmutah.com
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non-OEM toner) saying you didn't ship the
 
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