crossover cables and XP

[Chris_M]

I have two machines both running XP. I can connect them using two
normal Ethernet cables and a hub (or router, I forget), but when I try
to use an Ethernet crossover cable, it doesn’t work. Anyone know why
this is?

 

[David H. Lipman]

Stick to using a hub, while x-over cables have their purposes, it is not the proper way to
do networking. With twisted-pair Ethernet, hubs are the correct method.

Just to answer the question, one PC may be set to 10Mb/s while the other may be set to
100Mb/s thus not communicating. A 10/100Nb/s hub can automatically synch to the right
speed.

Dave



| I have two machines both running XP. I can connect them using two
| normal Ethernet cables and a hub (or router, I forget), but when I try
| to use an Ethernet crossover cable, it doesn't work. Anyone know why
| this is?
|
| --
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| Articles individually checked for conformance to usenet standards
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| Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse:
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[CZ]

A 10/100Mb/s hub can automatically synch to the right speed.

Dave

A hub cannot do 100 Mbps, a switch can, and a 10/100 MBps switch can
automatically switch between the two bandwidths.

 

[Chris_M]

Just to answer the question, one PC may be set to 10Mb/s while the
other may be set to
100Mb/s thus not communicating. A 10/100Nb/s hub can automatically
synch to the right
speed.

I tried fooling around with various settings to no avail, but maybe
that’s it. Thanks.

 

[David H. Lipman]

Please take a networking course.

There are 10/100Mb/s hubs and there are 10/100Mb/s Ethernet switches. They are NOT the
same. Both can auto-synch to the wire speed. However, an Ethernet switch breaks up each
port to its own collision domain while a hub is just a multiport repeater where all ports
are on the same collision domain. Each port on an Ethernet switch can be either Full-Duplex
or Half-Duplex. On hubs all ports must be Half-Duplex.

I guess you'll tell me the following product does NOT exist...

Netgear Model DS108 -- 8 PORT 10/100 Mbps Dual Speed Hub
http://www.netgear.com/products/prod_details.php?prodID=69&view=

Dave




| >> A 10/100Mb/s hub can automatically synch to the right speed.
|
| Dave
|
| A hub cannot do 100 Mbps, a switch can, and a 10/100 MBps switch can
| automatically switch between the two bandwidths.
|
|
|

 

[David H. Lipman]

So what model is the hub you are using ?

Have you gone into the Advanced Tab for the NIC in the Device Manager and set the Media Type
to "Auto Select" (can be similar wording).

Dave




| "David H. Lipman" wrote:
| > Just to answer the question, one PC may be set to 10Mb/s while the
| > other may be set to
| > 100Mb/s thus not communicating. A 10/100Nb/s hub can automatically
| > synch to the right
| > speed.
| >
|
| I tried fooling around with various settings to no avail, but maybe
| that's it. Thanks.
|
| --
| http://www.WindowsForumz.com/ This article was posted by author's request
| Articles individually checked for conformance to usenet standards
| Topic URL:
http://www.WindowsForumz.com/General-Discussion-crossover-cables-XP-ftopict156638.html
| Visit Topic URL to contact author (reg. req'd). Report abuse:
http://www.WindowsForumz.com/eform.php?p=452096

 

[Steve Shattuck]

A hub cannot do 100 Mbps, a switch can, and a 10/100 MBps switch can

automatically switch between the two bandwidths.

DUH! There may not be stupid questions, but that sure doesn't apply to
answers.

 

[Ron Martell]

Stick to using a hub, while x-over cables have their purposes, it is not the proper way to
do networking. With twisted-pair Ethernet, hubs are the correct method.
Balderdash.



Just to answer the question, one PC may be set to 10Mb/s while the other may be set to
100Mb/s thus not communicating. A 10/100Nb/s hub can automatically synch to the right
speed.

Hogwash.


Ron Martell Duncan B.C. Canada
--
Microsoft MVP
On-Line Help Computer Service
http://onlinehelp.bc.ca

"The reason computer chips are so small is computers don't eat much."

 

[Ron Martell]

I have two machines both running XP. I can connect them using two
normal Ethernet cables and a hub (or router, I forget), but when I try
to use an Ethernet crossover cable, it doesn’t work. Anyone know why
this is?

Probably because of an i.p. address problem.

If you were previously using a Router then that would have included a
built-in DHCP (Dynamic Host Configuration Protocol) Server which
automatically assigns i.p. addresses to connected computers. Without
this server present your computers are not getting proper i.p.
addresses to allow them to connect to each other.

Do the following procedure on each computer:

Open Control Panel - Network Connections
Right-click on the icon for the ethernet card and select Properties.
Click on the item named "Internet Protocol (TCP/IP) to select it and
then click on the Properties button.
Click on the button labelled "Use the following IP address".
On the first computer enter the value 192 168 001 010
On the second computer enter the value 192 168 001 020
On both computers enter the value 255 255 255 0 in the Subnet mask
line (that should be automatically filled in by XP)
Do not enter anything in the Default Gateway box.
Click on Apply and OK as needed to exit.

Your network should now work between the two computers.

Good luck


Ron Martell Duncan B.C. Canada
--
Microsoft MVP
On-Line Help Computer Service
http://onlinehelp.bc.ca

"The reason computer chips are so small is computers don't eat much."

 

[David H. Lipman]

Stmulating one word replies !

If one NIC is specifically set to 10Mb/s Half-Duplex and the other NIC is specifically set
to 100Mb/s Half-Duplex they will NOT communicate. They will "if" they are both set to "auto
sense" the wire speed.

As for the x-over cable. That's an opinion and I stick to it. The *only* time to use a
x-over cable is when going between hubs/switches that don't have a MDI/MDI-X switch.

Dave



|
| >Stick to using a hub, while x-over cables have their purposes, it is not the proper way
to
| >do networking. With twisted-pair Ethernet, hubs are the correct method.
|
| Balderdash.
|
|
| >
| >Just to answer the question, one PC may be set to 10Mb/s while the other may be set to
| >100Mb/s thus not communicating. A 10/100Nb/s hub can automatically synch to the right
| >speed.
| >
|
| Hogwash.
|
|
| Ron Martell Duncan B.C. Canada
| --
| Microsoft MVP
| On-Line Help Computer Service
| http://onlinehelp.bc.ca
|
| "The reason computer chips are so small is computers don't eat much."

 

[Resonate]

agreed lol

DUH! There may not be stupid questions, but that sure doesn't apply to
answers.

 

[V Green]

Stmulating one word replies !

If one NIC is specifically set to 10Mb/s Half-Duplex and the other NIC is specifically set
to 100Mb/s Half-Duplex they will NOT communicate. They will "if" they are both set to "auto
sense" the wire speed.

Which is almost *always* the NIC driver default. So
it will most likely work. Not many users override or even
know where this setting is. If they do, and have manually
changed it, they should know why their x-over setup doesn't
work...

As for the x-over cable. That's an opinion and I stick to it. The *only* time to use a
x-over cable is when going between hubs/switches that don't have a

MDI/MDI-X switch.

There are also some limitations on cable length using X-over.
I had a MSKB article on it once years ago, but can't find it
now. Basically, it said the cable need to be some minimum
length to work properly.

 

[cquirke (MVP Win9x)]

On Sat, 21 Aug 2004 13:16:51 -0400, "David H. Lipman"

Stick to using a hub, while x-over cables have their purposes, it is not the proper way to
do networking. With twisted-pair Ethernet, hubs are the correct method.

Just to answer the question, one PC may be set to 10Mb/s while the other may be set to
100Mb/s thus not communicating. A 10/100Nb/s hub can automatically synch to the right
speed.

Can also be incorrect crossover wiring. The following works:

o -> g
O -> G
g -> o
L -> b
l -> B
G -> O
b -> L
B -> l

Legend:

O = Orange, o = Orange and White
G = Green, g = Green and White
L = Blue, l = Blue and White
B = Brown, b = Brown and White

Cards that are 10MHz only will usually have both UTP and the older
round BNC connector. Cards with only a UTP socket are more likely to
be 10/100MHz, if not 10/100/1000MHz.

Unless you have "locked down" a particular mode in some way (e.g.
within the card's EPROM via a DOS utility), faster cards can be
expected to auto-detect slowerv traffic and work.

It may also be that your crossover cable is correctly wired, but
otherwise duff in some way, i.e. cable break, poor plug grip, etc.

Hubs and switched are cheaper these days, but if you are sure you only
need 2 PCs to be LANned, you should not be obliged to buy one.

---------- ----- ---- --- -- - - - -

Consumer Asks: "What are you?"
Market Research: ' What would you like us to be? '

 

[CZ]

There are 10/100Mb/s hubs and there are 10/100Mb/s Ethernet switches.same. Both can auto-synch to the wire speed. However, an Ethernet switch
breaks up each
port to its own collision domain while a hub is just a multiport repeater
where all ports
are on the same collision domain. Each port on an Ethernet switch can be
either Full-Duplex
or Half-Duplex. On hubs all ports must be Half-Duplex.

Dave:

Agreed, my mistake.

Personally, I would avoid using a 10/100Mbps switching hub for the reasons
you mentioned:
All hub ports share the same collision domain, whereas a switch creates a
separate collision domain between each pair of ports.
And a switch supports full duplex, where as a hub does not.
Therefore, effective network bandwidth can be higher with a switch.

Also, network security can be improved with a switch, as it can limit the
effectiveness of packet sniffing.

 

[David Candy]

The electronics in a multispeed hubs are switch type circuits not hub type circuits. I consider multiple speed hubs to be switches based on how they work rather than what they do. And I would buy a switch rather than paying for a switch's electronics and getting the function of a hub.

 

[CZ]

The electronics in a multispeed hubs are switch type circuits not hub
David:

Per some research:
Hubs use a common collision domain per hub speed.
For a 10/100Mbps hub there are two methods:
1) The hub can set the speed for all ports to the speed of the lowest
connected device.
So, all ports would have the same speed. (this hub uses a single backplane)
2) The hub can have two backplanes connected by a switch. One backplane is
for 10Mbps, the other is for 100Mbps. This allows each port to have a
different speed, as the port will use the appropriate backplane for the
speed of the device connected to the port.

An impt issue is the OSI layer used, as OSI layer 1 (hubs) involves a shared
collision domain, whereas OSI layer 2 (switches) does not.

 

[David Candy]

No the important thing is the electronics. It's a switch. It may work as a hub but it is a switch.

 

[CZ]

No the important thing is the electronics. It's a switch. It may work as
David:

Will a packet sniffer on a 100Mbps port of a 10/100Mbps hub see all of the
100Mbps packets going through the hub?

If it sees all of them, then the 10/100Mbps device acts like a hub.

If it only sees the packets for its ws's connections, then the device acts
like a switch.

 

[David Candy]

F*ck head you are so stupid. You cannot have dual speed hubs. You have a switch. Look at the circuitry. And read my post sh1t for brains.

based on how they work rather than what they do

So shove it up your arse.

 

[David H. Lipman]

No it isn't !

Sorry, CZ is correct, you are wrong. The electronics and the resultant capabilities of hubs
and switches differ radically.

Dave





No the important thing is the electronics. It's a switch. It may work as a hub but it is a
switch.