CPU fan doesn't run during boot-up

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ovidescu

Hi all

I recently bought myself the parts for my new computer (INTEL Pentium4
531 boxed, 2x512 DDR2 533MHz Kingmax, GIGABYTE GA-945PL-S3 I945PL mobo,
ASUS EAX1300PRO-SILENT/TD/256M video card, Hiper Power HPU-3S350 350W
power source) and put it together. At the very first boot-up sequence
everything ran as it was supposed to (got Windows XP SP2 installed in
under 15 minutes). This is my first super computer and needless to say
I was over-excited. Anyway, before installing Windows I went through
the usual setting up of the BIOS. I enabled the "CPU fan failure"
signal beep, also "Smart CPU fan mode" (whatever that was), booted up
from the CD-ROM and installed WinXP. I spent the rest of the day
installing software and games and all went smooth.
The surprise came the next day, when I got back from work and hit the
power button on my computer case. I got the CPU fan failure beep !!!
(which is quite annoying). I immediately hit the power button, opened
up the case and with my eyes on the CPU fan, hit the power button
again. The fan stayed motionless. I even tried to give it a boost
manually, but nothing happened (the CPU fan failure beep was creeping
me out). Again I turned it off, turned it on, entered BIOS, disabled
"Smart CPU fan mode" and continued to normal boot-up sequence. To my
surprise, no more CPU fan failure beep. I continued on playing Quake 4
for the rest of the day and all was okay. Until the next day... when I
got the CPU fan failure beep AGAIN. I entered BIOS, went to "PC health
status" section, 0 RPM for the CPU fan, about 12 centigrades for the
CPU itself (which was slowly and constantly rising about 1 centigrade
every 2 seconds) and I disabled the "CPU fan failure"signal beep (still
0 RPM for the CPU fan). Saved the changes, restarted the computer (no
more CPU fan failure beep), entered BIOS, went to "PC health status"
section: about 19 centigrades for the CPU, still 0 RPM for the CPU fan.
I waited a bit and to my surprise, when the CPU hit 21 centigrades, the
fan started rolling, at first at 1600 RPM, then a little faster. I
restarted again and went on with the usual stuff.
After this, each time I boot-up for the first time, I first enter BIOS,
watch the CPU heat up from 10 to 21 centigrades and the CPU fan go from
0 to 1600 RPM the instant the CPU hits 20-21 centigrades. I still have
"CPU fan failure" signal beep and "Smart CPU fan mode" both disabled.
Has anyone ever had a problem similar to mine ?
Is it that INTEL has implemented some new technology (something like
AMD's "Cool and quiet") on its new chipsets, some that I haven't heard
of (and I consider myself to know pretty much everything INTEL cooks
up--in case you haven't figured it out by now, I am an INTEL fan) OR I
really need to get a new cooler for my CPU ?

ANY help/suggestions greatly appreciated.

Thanks
 
i think your particular model of mobo turns the fan on/off according
to its temperature. i guess it would do that to have more power for
the rest of the pc and only uses the fan when it needs it.
 
ovidescu said:
Hi all

I recently bought myself the parts for my new computer (INTEL Pentium4
531 boxed, 2x512 DDR2 533MHz Kingmax, GIGABYTE GA-945PL-S3 I945PL mobo,
ASUS EAX1300PRO-SILENT/TD/256M video card, Hiper Power HPU-3S350 350W
power source) and put it together. At the very first boot-up sequence
everything ran as it was supposed to (got Windows XP SP2 installed in
under 15 minutes). This is my first super computer and needless to say
I was over-excited. Anyway, before installing Windows I went through
the usual setting up of the BIOS. I enabled the "CPU fan failure"
signal beep, also "Smart CPU fan mode" (whatever that was), booted up
from the CD-ROM and installed WinXP. I spent the rest of the day
installing software and games and all went smooth.
The surprise came the next day, when I got back from work and hit the
power button on my computer case. I got the CPU fan failure beep !!!
(which is quite annoying). I immediately hit the power button, opened
up the case and with my eyes on the CPU fan, hit the power button
again. The fan stayed motionless. I even tried to give it a boost
manually, but nothing happened (the CPU fan failure beep was creeping
me out). Again I turned it off, turned it on, entered BIOS, disabled
"Smart CPU fan mode" and continued to normal boot-up sequence. To my
surprise, no more CPU fan failure beep. I continued on playing Quake 4
for the rest of the day and all was okay. Until the next day... when I
got the CPU fan failure beep AGAIN. I entered BIOS, went to "PC health
status" section, 0 RPM for the CPU fan, about 12 centigrades for the
CPU itself (which was slowly and constantly rising about 1 centigrade
every 2 seconds) and I disabled the "CPU fan failure"signal beep (still
0 RPM for the CPU fan). Saved the changes, restarted the computer (no
more CPU fan failure beep), entered BIOS, went to "PC health status"
section: about 19 centigrades for the CPU, still 0 RPM for the CPU fan.
I waited a bit and to my surprise, when the CPU hit 21 centigrades, the
fan started rolling, at first at 1600 RPM, then a little faster. I
restarted again and went on with the usual stuff.
After this, each time I boot-up for the first time, I first enter BIOS,
watch the CPU heat up from 10 to 21 centigrades and the CPU fan go from
0 to 1600 RPM the instant the CPU hits 20-21 centigrades. I still have
"CPU fan failure" signal beep and "Smart CPU fan mode" both disabled.
Has anyone ever had a problem similar to mine ?
Is it that INTEL has implemented some new technology (something like
AMD's "Cool and quiet") on its new chipsets, some that I haven't heard
of (and I consider myself to know pretty much everything INTEL cooks
up--in case you haven't figured it out by now, I am an INTEL fan) OR I
really need to get a new cooler for my CPU ?

ANY help/suggestions greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Click to expand...

from googling, that MBRD has an Intel chipset. But, all MBRDs report
CPU fan speed. It's just the BIOS that has a - perhaps - badly thought
out setting of reporting when the speed is 0RPM. I guess it's purely a
funny BIOS you have, so i suppose a company ilke phoenix or AMI,
whoever wrote your BIOS, are to blame (you'll see when you go into the
bios). maybe flash the BIOS 'cos they've updated it to correct the
problem.
It's bad communication between cpu heatsink/cpu cooler manufacturerers
and BIOS makers. More a fault of CPU cooler manufacturers. 0RPM
should be reported. The cooler manufacturers should compromise and make
their coolers run inaudibly slow as soon as the power is on.
What make/model cpu cooler do you have?
 
ovidescu said:
Hi all

I recently bought myself the parts for my new computer (INTEL Pentium4
531 boxed, 2x512 DDR2 533MHz Kingmax, GIGABYTE GA-945PL-S3 I945PL mobo,
ASUS EAX1300PRO-SILENT/TD/256M video card, Hiper Power HPU-3S350 350W
power source) and put it together. At the very first boot-up sequence
everything ran as it was supposed to (got Windows XP SP2 installed in
under 15 minutes). This is my first super computer and needless to say
I was over-excited. Anyway, before installing Windows I went through
the usual setting up of the BIOS. I enabled the "CPU fan failure"
signal beep, also "Smart CPU fan mode" (whatever that was), booted up
from the CD-ROM and installed WinXP. I spent the rest of the day
installing software and games and all went smooth.
The surprise came the next day, when I got back from work and hit the
power button on my computer case. I got the CPU fan failure beep !!!
(which is quite annoying). I immediately hit the power button, opened
up the case and with my eyes on the CPU fan, hit the power button
again. The fan stayed motionless. I even tried to give it a boost
manually, but nothing happened (the CPU fan failure beep was creeping
me out). Again I turned it off, turned it on, entered BIOS, disabled
"Smart CPU fan mode" and continued to normal boot-up sequence. To my
surprise, no more CPU fan failure beep. I continued on playing Quake 4
for the rest of the day and all was okay. Until the next day... when I
got the CPU fan failure beep AGAIN. I entered BIOS, went to "PC health
status" section, 0 RPM for the CPU fan, about 12 centigrades for the
CPU itself (which was slowly and constantly rising about 1 centigrade
every 2 seconds) and I disabled the "CPU fan failure"signal beep (still
0 RPM for the CPU fan). Saved the changes, restarted the computer (no
more CPU fan failure beep), entered BIOS, went to "PC health status"
section: about 19 centigrades for the CPU, still 0 RPM for the CPU fan.
I waited a bit and to my surprise, when the CPU hit 21 centigrades, the
fan started rolling, at first at 1600 RPM, then a little faster. I
restarted again and went on with the usual stuff.
After this, each time I boot-up for the first time, I first enter BIOS,
watch the CPU heat up from 10 to 21 centigrades and the CPU fan go from
0 to 1600 RPM the instant the CPU hits 20-21 centigrades. I still have
"CPU fan failure" signal beep and "Smart CPU fan mode" both disabled.
Has anyone ever had a problem similar to mine ?
Is it that INTEL has implemented some new technology (something like
AMD's "Cool and quiet") on its new chipsets, some that I haven't heard
of (and I consider myself to know pretty much everything INTEL cooks
up--in case you haven't figured it out by now, I am an INTEL fan) OR I
really need to get a new cooler for my CPU ?

ANY help/suggestions greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Click to expand...

I hope you have a setting on your bios to warn you when the cpu temp
gets too high eg above 60.
i'm not sure of a hardware way of implementing that.
I've seen hardware - a piece of electronics , a wire with a thing in
the middle, but that might also just detect RPM=0.
Any fan that is going to do something as silly as RPM=0 for some
moments when the compouter is on and cpu temp is very low, should have
its own warning system when the fan stops!


By the way. If you backprobe your Hiper PSU with a multimeter, you
might find it's not that good! I had 2 Hiper ones. One of them was
really hyper, voltage jumping all over the place. The other one , well,
was fairly stable in voltages, but at 13V and 11V and even 10V. maybe
too high, certainly too low at times. This is on the 12V rail of
course.
Get a good make of PSU. You'll find lists.
 
ovidescu said:
Hi all

I recently bought myself the parts for my new computer (INTEL Pentium4
531 boxed, 2x512 DDR2 533MHz Kingmax, GIGABYTE GA-945PL-S3 I945PL mobo,
ASUS EAX1300PRO-SILENT/TD/256M video card, Hiper Power HPU-3S350 350W
power source) and put it together. At the very first boot-up sequence
everything ran as it was supposed to (got Windows XP SP2 installed in
under 15 minutes). This is my first super computer and needless to say
I was over-excited. Anyway, before installing Windows I went through
the usual setting up of the BIOS. I enabled the "CPU fan failure"
signal beep, also "Smart CPU fan mode" (whatever that was), booted up
from the CD-ROM and installed WinXP. I spent the rest of the day
installing software and games and all went smooth.
The surprise came the next day, when I got back from work and hit the
power button on my computer case. I got the CPU fan failure beep !!!
(which is quite annoying). I immediately hit the power button, opened
up the case and with my eyes on the CPU fan, hit the power button
again. The fan stayed motionless. I even tried to give it a boost
manually, but nothing happened (the CPU fan failure beep was creeping
me out). Again I turned it off, turned it on, entered BIOS, disabled
"Smart CPU fan mode" and continued to normal boot-up sequence. To my
surprise, no more CPU fan failure beep. I continued on playing Quake 4
for the rest of the day and all was okay. Until the next day... when I
got the CPU fan failure beep AGAIN. I entered BIOS, went to "PC health
status" section, 0 RPM for the CPU fan, about 12 centigrades for the
CPU itself (which was slowly and constantly rising about 1 centigrade
every 2 seconds) and I disabled the "CPU fan failure"signal beep (still
0 RPM for the CPU fan). Saved the changes, restarted the computer (no
more CPU fan failure beep), entered BIOS, went to "PC health status"
section: about 19 centigrades for the CPU, still 0 RPM for the CPU fan.
I waited a bit and to my surprise, when the CPU hit 21 centigrades, the
fan started rolling, at first at 1600 RPM, then a little faster. I
restarted again and went on with the usual stuff.
After this, each time I boot-up for the first time, I first enter BIOS,
watch the CPU heat up from 10 to 21 centigrades and the CPU fan go from
0 to 1600 RPM the instant the CPU hits 20-21 centigrades. I still have
"CPU fan failure" signal beep and "Smart CPU fan mode" both disabled.
Has anyone ever had a problem similar to mine ?
Is it that INTEL has implemented some new technology (something like
AMD's "Cool and quiet") on its new chipsets, some that I haven't heard
of (and I consider myself to know pretty much everything INTEL cooks
up--in case you haven't figured it out by now, I am an INTEL fan) OR I
really need to get a new cooler for my CPU ?

ANY help/suggestions greatly appreciated.

Thanks
Click to expand...

I don't know anything about the Intel motherboards, but I can pass on
some generic info.

There are a couple ways the CPU fan speed can be controlled.

1) Intel in the past, has made the boxed heatsink/fan sensitive to the
air temperature inside the computer case. The Intel fan has a
thermistor mounted in the fan hub, and the thermistor controls the
fan speed. As the computer case air gets warmer, the fan will spin
faster. The Intel datasheet for your processor, will state the
two temperature points used to "ramp" the fan speed. But according
to Intel, the fan should spin at all times.

2) Motherboards can also have voltage control of the CPU fan header.
The motherboard can monitor the CPU temperature, and adjust the
voltage to the CPU fan header, to trade off CPU temperature for
fan noise. The BIOS may offer some setting which switches on
this voltage reduction feature (like your Smart CPU Fan mode).

It is possible if both techniques are combined, to have a fan
spinning at zero RPMs (that is because using both techniques at the
same time, means the fan runs even slower than with either technique
by itself). But, since the average BIOS is designed to
detect a zero RPM spin state, as a fan failure, it takes careful
coordination of the BIOS design, if the design intent was really
to allow for the fan to stop. I'd say they probably did not intend
for the fan to stop, if the BIOS is flagging the failure.

To avoid any voltage control issues from the motherboard, you
may be able to find a power adapter that goes from a Molex disk
drive power connector, to a three pin fan header. Note that your
Intel fan has a four pin connector, and one pin will "hang over"
if used with the adapter. The fourth pin does not need to be driven,
and a four pin Intel fan can run from a three pin header. Running with
the adapter, ensures the fan is getting the full +12V.

If the fan continues to start at zero RPM, when the system starts,
then I would conclude the fan was defective. It could be that
the thermistor inside the fan hub, is "overdoing it" when adjusting
the fan speed.

So, it could be that the Intel fan itself is not working properly.
Or, it could be the combination of Intel fan plus motherboard
Smart Fan feature. Running the fan from an adapter may help distinguish
between the two states, and whether the fan is working properly.

Paul
 
Paul a scris:
I don't know anything about the Intel motherboards, but I can pass on
some generic info.

There are a couple ways the CPU fan speed can be controlled.

1) Intel in the past, has made the boxed heatsink/fan sensitive to the
air temperature inside the computer case. The Intel fan has a
thermistor mounted in the fan hub, and the thermistor controls the
fan speed. As the computer case air gets warmer, the fan will spin
faster. The Intel datasheet for your processor, will state the
two temperature points used to "ramp" the fan speed. But according
to Intel, the fan should spin at all times.

2) Motherboards can also have voltage control of the CPU fan header.
The motherboard can monitor the CPU temperature, and adjust the
voltage to the CPU fan header, to trade off CPU temperature for
fan noise. The BIOS may offer some setting which switches on
this voltage reduction feature (like your Smart CPU Fan mode).

It is possible if both techniques are combined, to have a fan
spinning at zero RPMs (that is because using both techniques at the
same time, means the fan runs even slower than with either technique
by itself). But, since the average BIOS is designed to
detect a zero RPM spin state, as a fan failure, it takes careful
coordination of the BIOS design, if the design intent was really
to allow for the fan to stop. I'd say they probably did not intend
for the fan to stop, if the BIOS is flagging the failure.

To avoid any voltage control issues from the motherboard, you
may be able to find a power adapter that goes from a Molex disk
drive power connector, to a three pin fan header. Note that your
Intel fan has a four pin connector, and one pin will "hang over"
if used with the adapter. The fourth pin does not need to be driven,
and a four pin Intel fan can run from a three pin header. Running with
the adapter, ensures the fan is getting the full +12V.

If the fan continues to start at zero RPM, when the system starts,
then I would conclude the fan was defective. It could be that
the thermistor inside the fan hub, is "overdoing it" when adjusting
the fan speed.

So, it could be that the Intel fan itself is not working properly.
Or, it could be the combination of Intel fan plus motherboard
Smart Fan feature. Running the fan from an adapter may help distinguish
between the two states, and whether the fan is working properly.

Paul
Click to expand...

Thank you Paul for the lengthy explanations. I will try using the power
adapter from the case cooler and see if the fan continues to run at 0
RPM at system start.

I have worked with Intel boxed CPUs before, as well as Hiper Power
power supplies and never had any problems. I used to build DVR systems
as well as provide service and troubleshooting for them and never ever
had a CPU fan failure or power supply go amok. But alas, things
sometimes do go wrong so maybe it's just that time.

I will keep you posted with my progress on the problem.

Ovidiu
 
(e-mail address removed) a scris:
from googling, that MBRD has an Intel chipset. But, all MBRDs report
CPU fan speed. It's just the BIOS that has a - perhaps - badly thought
out setting of reporting when the speed is 0RPM. I guess it's purely a
funny BIOS you have, so i suppose a company ilke phoenix or AMI,
whoever wrote your BIOS, are to blame (you'll see when you go into the
bios). maybe flash the BIOS 'cos they've updated it to correct the
problem.
It's bad communication between cpu heatsink/cpu cooler manufacturerers
and BIOS makers. More a fault of CPU cooler manufacturers. 0RPM
should be reported. The cooler manufacturers should compromise and make
their coolers run inaudibly slow as soon as the power is on.
What make/model cpu cooler do you have?
Click to expand...

The CPU cooler is the one Intel provides in the box the CPU comes in.
So it's an Intel make.
The mobo does report 0 RPM correctly, I opened up my case and was
looking at the fan, which was still like a rock, and the BIOS read 0
RPM.

Anyway, I will try Paul's idea, using an adapter for a Molex disk drive
power connector see if the fan spins or not.

Ovidiu
 
(e-mail address removed) a scris:
I hope you have a setting on your bios to warn you when the cpu temp
gets too high eg above 60.
i'm not sure of a hardware way of implementing that.
I've seen hardware - a piece of electronics , a wire with a thing in
the middle, but that might also just detect RPM=0.
Any fan that is going to do something as silly as RPM=0 for some
moments when the compouter is on and cpu temp is very low, should have
its own warning system when the fan stops!


By the way. If you backprobe your Hiper PSU with a multimeter, you
might find it's not that good! I had 2 Hiper ones. One of them was
really hyper, voltage jumping all over the place. The other one , well,
was fairly stable in voltages, but at 13V and 11V and even 10V. maybe
too high, certainly too low at times. This is on the 12V rail of
course.
Get a good make of PSU. You'll find lists.
Click to expand...

I did enable the warning for the CPU temp and set it for 60
centigrades.

As I replied to Paul's post, I have worked with Hiper PSUs before and
never had any problems. But maybe I just got "lucky" and picked a
defective one this time. I will give Paul's idea a try, using the power
adapter, and after that, if things still look bad, get a new PSU, maybe
an Antec.

Ovidiu
 
Paul said:
I don't know anything about the Intel motherboards, but I can pass on
some generic info.

There are a couple ways the CPU fan speed can be controlled.

1) Intel in the past, has made the boxed heatsink/fan sensitive to the
air temperature inside the computer case. The Intel fan has a
thermistor mounted in the fan hub, and the thermistor controls the
fan speed. As the computer case air gets warmer, the fan will spin
faster. The Intel datasheet for your processor, will state the
two temperature points used to "ramp" the fan speed. But according
to Intel, the fan should spin at all times.

2) Motherboards can also have voltage control of the CPU fan header.
The motherboard can monitor the CPU temperature, and adjust the
voltage to the CPU fan header, to trade off CPU temperature for
fan noise. The BIOS may offer some setting which switches on
this voltage reduction feature (like your Smart CPU Fan mode).

It is possible if both techniques are combined, to have a fan
spinning at zero RPMs (that is because using both techniques at the
same time, means the fan runs even slower than with either technique
by itself). But, since the average BIOS is designed to
detect a zero RPM spin state, as a fan failure, it takes careful
coordination of the BIOS design, if the design intent was really
to allow for the fan to stop. I'd say they probably did not intend
for the fan to stop, if the BIOS is flagging the failure.

To avoid any voltage control issues from the motherboard, you
may be able to find a power adapter that goes from a Molex disk
drive power connector, to a three pin fan header. Note that your
Intel fan has a four pin connector, and one pin will "hang over"
if used with the adapter. The fourth pin does not need to be driven,
and a four pin Intel fan can run from a three pin header. Running with
the adapter, ensures the fan is getting the full +12V.

If the fan continues to start at zero RPM, when the system starts,
then I would conclude the fan was defective. It could be that
the thermistor inside the fan hub, is "overdoing it" when adjusting
the fan speed.

So, it could be that the Intel fan itself is not working properly.
Or, it could be the combination of Intel fan plus motherboard
Smart Fan feature. Running the fan from an adapter may help distinguish
between the two states, and whether the fan is working properly.

Paul
Click to expand...

I tried the power adapter today and the fan started spinning the moment
I hit the power button. So I'm guessing it's some new technique that
allows the fan not to spin at all if CPU temp is too low, thus saving
some power.
Thank you for your advice. Now I know I have a perfectly working CPU
fan.

Ovidiu
 
LOL, sounds like a bug in config parsing.....I would suggest clearing
the CMOS (As you stated on first boot everything went fine), and BIOS
settings will return to their factory state
 
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