compatibility recommendation between FF and IE

  • Thread starter Thread starter ebuild
  • Start date Start date
E

ebuild

Hi,
I 'm in the final stage in website development and everythings go fine
except,I think, one big trouble.

The test I was performing to view pages was only on internet explorer
and in the dev's final stage when trying to view them on Firefox the
layout was badly different than its look in ie.

Fortunately the page rendering is based on templates so fixing this
issue will not take a long time.

I need advice or some compatibility recommendation between FF and IE
on how to solve this problem as the Firefox's user number is rising

Best Regards,
 
ebuild said:
Hi,
I 'm in the final stage in website development and everythings go fine
except,I think, one big trouble.

The test I was performing to view pages was only on internet explorer
and in the dev's final stage when trying to view them on Firefox the
layout was badly different than its look in ie.

Fortunately the page rendering is based on templates so fixing this
issue will not take a long time.

I need advice or some compatibility recommendation between FF and IE
on how to solve this problem as the Firefox's user number is rising

Best Regards,
Click to expand...

Not to sound too negative, but in developing web pages if you want to be
certain, you really have to test them with at least the most common browsers
and especially any that you know your audience might use. Don't depend on,
for instance, the fact that Netscape was used for developing browser F,
that, since Browser F works, Netscape will too, and vice-versa. It ain't
necessarily so.
Probably the hardest to accomodate is WebTV. So, it helps a lot if one
knows their audience.

Google will lead you to plenty of advice on this subject of browser
compatability. I'd suggest a couple of links but there are to many good
ones I think it's better to leave the choices to you.

At the same time, there are also many things you can do in your design that
will help assure (not guarantee) compatability between browsers so watch for
those links, too.

HTH
Pop`
 
ebuild said:
Hi,
I 'm in the final stage in website development and everythings go fine
except,I think, one big trouble.

The test I was performing to view pages was only on internet explorer
and in the dev's final stage when trying to view them on Firefox the
layout was badly different than its look in ie.

Fortunately the page rendering is based on templates so fixing this
issue will not take a long time.

I need advice or some compatibility recommendation between FF and IE
on how to solve this problem as the Firefox's user number is rising
Click to expand...

Here is some advice I gave to someone recently on this very topic:

"Design your pages in accordance with the standards, testing initially
with browsers that are highly standards compliant, like Firefox, Opera,
and Safari. Then test with IE and make what minor tweaks may be
necessary to overcome IE's defects.

"This may sound counterintuitive, given IE's popularity, but it is
easier to design pages properly, in accordance with the standards, and
then to make minor tweaks to accommodate IE, than it is to design pages
improperly, for IE, and then to figure out how to fix bad code to make
it work with good browsers."
 
C said:
Here is some advice I gave to someone recently on this very topic:

"Design your pages in accordance with the standards, testing initially
with browsers that are highly standards compliant, like Firefox,
Opera, and Safari. Then test with IE and make what minor tweaks may
be necessary to overcome IE's defects.

"This may sound counterintuitive, given IE's popularity, but it is
easier to design pages properly, in accordance with the standards, and
then to make minor tweaks to accommodate IE, than it is to design
pages improperly, for IE, and then to figure out how to fix bad code
to make it work with good browsers."
Click to expand...

I do NOT mean the advice above is unsound:

Actually it's the other way round; IE will display a lot of bad code that
the others won't display, because it was originally intended to be more
tolerant of bad code. IE6 tightened that a little, ie7 more, and supposedly
Vista's IE7 is even more compliant, but who knows?
Regardless, it's still a matter of proper testing at the right times
during design stages. Trying to write code that is ultra-complaint to the
w3 specs will drive you nuts, plus there are so many different
interpretations of it that it's another frustration area of its own. The
only "real" spec I work hard to adhere to is the ADA requirements as I've
found it makes the best bang for the buck with an overal mixed audience.
And if you're using a purchased software to author your web pages, forget
it: None except a couple of very expensive ones can adhere to the code
literally.

Actually, the best, and easiest "test" is to put your code through an
analyzer and see how it rates. Unfortunately I cannot find the links to the
ones I last used or I'd post them. Google will make it easy enough to find
them though. Some even include comments on which browsers will have
problems with what, but you still need to use the actual browsers to be
sure.
If you can't find any such links, come on back and ask; I'll dig up the
ones I used last from archive and see where they came from.

HTH
Pop`
 
Poprivet said:
I do NOT mean the advice above is unsound:

Actually it's the other way round; IE will display a lot of bad code that
the others won't display, because it was originally intended to be more
tolerant of bad code. IE6 tightened that a little, ie7 more, and supposedly
Vista's IE7 is even more compliant, but who knows?
Click to expand...

Who knows? I do, as do many others who build sites on a daily basis.
IE7 is more compliant, but generally still lags behind Opera and the
Gecko-based browsers in terms of standards compliance.
Regardless, it's still a matter of proper testing at the right times
during design stages. Trying to write code that is ultra-complaint to the
w3 specs will drive you nuts, plus there are so many different
interpretations of it that it's another frustration area of its own.
Click to expand...

I have been coding to the specs for years: I have found that doing so
is getting easier and easier as the browsers are made more compliant.
Right now IE remains the problem child -- the major cause of frustration
-- but there are standard work-arounds to its defects: typically IE may
need a few different lines of CSS. This is no reason to drive anyone nuts.

As to there being so many different interpretations of the specs: no,
there aren't. The current HTML spec has, for many years, been version
4.01; the current CSS spec has been version 2, though most designers
code to the upcoming, but well-defined, version 2.1. The specs are
quite clear: the most significant problems with the specs result from
features which are defined to depend on the user agent, e.g. the
position of the markers in LI lists.
Actually, the best, and easiest "test" is to put your code through an
analyzer and see how it rates. Unfortunately I cannot find the links to the
ones I last used or I'd post them.
Click to expand...

The prime analyzer (after the human brain) is an HTML or CSS validator.
Make code that passes these tools, and you are WAY ahead. I also use
a code checker, such as I think you are alluding to, but rarely, mainly
just before site deployment. The next step after validation is checking
pages with browsers that are highly standards compliant: if something
is not right at this stage, it is likely not because the code is bad,
but because the thinking behind the code is faulty. The next step after
this is checking pages with the various versions of IE, and as I
mentioned above, there are standard work-arounds for its defects: the
most recent site I built has two different lines of CSS for IE, and one
different line of JavaScript, easily handled using IE's conditional
comments.
 
Ok, a part of the problem may be solved by using Table instead of
Div , so what I need is kind of "Use/Don't Use" Check list, I think
it will be appreciated by many developer, currently javascript is not
a priority as I didn't use it yet.
 
Hi Ebuild,

I had to jump it to this thread when I saw it.

My nickle of advice is KISS - keep it simple/stupid.

Yes avoid divs (float, position....etc). Tables provide a framework for the
layout of your HTML page (follow layout principles in your design... the law
of gravity). Use percentage sizing of your table width... the contents of
your web page will wrap depending upon the size of the users monitor.
Avoid also hardcoded font families ,sizes and colors (users can choose their
own preferences for page backgrounds and forcolor and text size). Actually
you may consider using no styling whatsoever. User stylesheets can be
installed on browsers and these can completely negate your server-side
styling... after all "The User is King".

Thats about it...once you add scripting to your page you will have a new set
of issues to deal with. Thats another story you could write a book about.
(FYI - use hyperlinks or window.open to navigate your site, ShowModalDialog,
ShowModelessDialog and CreatePopupwindow are IE only methods.)

You may want to download and install the Developer Toolbar from MS

http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/...64-672d-4511-bb3e-2d5e1db91038&displaylang=en

It will help you identify elements of you page layout and has some built-in
tools to validate your html code to determine if it will be standards
compliant... In this case less is better... with less styling and less
complexity there is less to your page could have wrong with it.

Regards.
 
Rob said:
Hi Ebuild,

I had to jump it to this thread when I saw it.

My nickle of advice is KISS - keep it simple/stupid.

Yes avoid divs (float, position....etc). Tables provide a framework
for the layout of your HTML page (follow layout principles in your
design... the law of gravity). Use percentage sizing of your table
width... the contents of your web page will wrap depending upon the
size of the users monitor. Avoid also hardcoded font families ,sizes and
colors (users can
choose their own preferences for page backgrounds and forcolor and
text size). Actually you may consider using no styling whatsoever.
User stylesheets can be installed on browsers and these can
completely negate your server-side styling... after all "The User is
King".
Click to expand...

You took the words right out of my mouth; as I was reading down thru the
excellent posts here, I realized that no one was actually directly
addressing the OP's original quest, which you did.
I particularly appreciate your realizing the "user is king"; too many
authors forget that these days and incorrectly believe they should have full
and absolute control over the page displays. Nothing chases me away quicker
when I'm surfing than a page I can't view well or position for comparisons,
whatever.

Regards,

Pop`
 
Appreciate the positive feedback. Regards.
Poprivet said:
You took the words right out of my mouth; as I was reading down thru the
excellent posts here, I realized that no one was actually directly
addressing the OP's original quest, which you did.
I particularly appreciate your realizing the "user is king"; too many
authors forget that these days and incorrectly believe they should have
full and absolute control over the page displays. Nothing chases me away
quicker when I'm surfing than a page I can't view well or position for
comparisons, whatever.

Regards,

Pop`
Click to expand...
 
I also appreciate what you said, I like giving things in pragmatic way
and I understand you, my posting opens a great discussion and I thanks
you all
 
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