Check this CNN story out

  • Thread starter Thread starter David
  • Start date Start date
http://www.cnn.com/2005/TECH/internet/05/24/internet.ransom.ap/index.html


Regards

David.

" Say no to Underware© on your PC"
Click to expand...
Social-Scientifically spoken:
Criminals have no point where they say: "This is enough". Else, they
would somehow be social, not antisocial and thus no longer criminal
minds. The most succesfull are the psychopaths, the over-adapted
within our society. That is why we always will be following their
trail without passing them. We can only try to catch the last (wo-)man
falling behing or getting careless. Psychopathic personalities, like
many hackers, are not visual as they perfectly adapted themselves to
our society and not even realize that they are doing wrong. Mostly,
they are well respected in their in vivo environment.
What worries me even more are the sociopaths. These kinda hackers are
no longer psychopaths. The are the unadapted.They can be found at the
end of the circular line, next to the psychopaths. One has to be
limited, not in IQ but is Social Quotient to ask money for a file on
one's own computer. They can not stay hidden and wil be fould because
they leave trials.
 
NonDisputandum.com said:
Social-Scientifically spoken:
Criminals have no point where they say: "This is enough". Else, they
would somehow be social, not antisocial and thus no longer criminal
minds. The most succesfull are the psychopaths, the over-adapted
within our society. That is why we always will be following their
trail without passing them. We can only try to catch the last (wo-)man
falling behing or getting careless. Psychopathic personalities, like
many hackers, are not visual as they perfectly adapted themselves to
our society and not even realize that they are doing wrong. Mostly,
they are well respected in their in vivo environment.
What worries me even more are the sociopaths. These kinda hackers are
no longer psychopaths. The are the unadapted.They can be found at the
end of the circular line, next to the psychopaths. One has to be
limited, not in IQ but is Social Quotient to ask money for a file on
one's own computer. They can not stay hidden and wil be fould because
they leave trials.

--
www.nondisputandum.com - soft reviews:
freeware to Protect & Clean your PC
freeware Office tools & Webbuilding aid
+ the Internet Addiction Test ;-)
Click to expand...

X-No-Archive: yes

Why do you say that a psychopath is over-adaptive. Do you believe that
having no concept of the feelings of others, no empathy, is an adaptation.
Most psychopaths are not perfectly adapted to our society, if they were they
wouldn't be identified as psychopaths.

Psychopaths are often attention seekers.... like Hackers and Defacers.

Regards

David.

" Say no to Underware© on your PC"
 
X-No-Archive: yes

Why do you say that a psychopath is over-adaptive. Do you believe that
having no concept of the feelings of others, no empathy, is an adaptation.
Most psychopaths are not perfectly adapted to our society, if they were they
wouldn't be identified as psychopaths.

Psychopaths are often attention seekers.... like Hackers and Defacers.

Regards

David.

" Say no to Underware© on your PC"
Click to expand...

Yes I call psychopaths over-adapted and sociopaths un-adapted.
It is the same kinda personality disorder, with a different social
reality.
Do you believe that
having no concept of the feelings of others, no empathy, is an adaptation.
Click to expand...

Yes, it's a pathologic adaptation that permits psychopaths to survive
, even become very successfull. They are not disturbed by any rules,
remorse or empathy, just like sociopaths, but they manage to live the
pathology like an 'advantage'. Anyway, what they think is an
advantage... but destroyes whatever lies in their way.
Most psychopaths are not perfectly adapted to our society,
if they were they wouldn't be identified as psychopaths.
Click to expand...

Exactly why psychopaths rarely are seen in the office of a
psychiatrist, and never diagnosed. What you mean is the sociopath.
Anyway,... it's all within the same DSM criteria ;-)
 
NonDisputandum.com said:
Yes I call psychopaths over-adapted and sociopaths un-adapted.
It is the same kinda personality disorder, with a different social
reality.


Yes, it's a pathologic adaptation that permits psychopaths to survive
, even become very successfull. They are not disturbed by any rules,
remorse or empathy, just like sociopaths, but they manage to live the
pathology like an 'advantage'. Anyway, what they think is an
advantage... but destroyes whatever lies in their way.


Exactly why psychopaths rarely are seen in the office of a
psychiatrist, and never diagnosed. What you mean is the sociopath.
Anyway,... it's all within the same DSM criteria ;-)
Click to expand...

.........................


The reason Psychopaths are rarely seen in the Office of a Psychiatrist is
because it's not recognised as a mental illness, and usually falls under the
classification of personality disorder. They are usually referred via the
police.

The term sociopath is a modern term for psychopath, the term sociopath is
considered more accurate and less stigmatising.

Although people with Psychopathic traits can be successful, true
psychopaths, those that have no conscious control of their pathology are
generally disadvantaged, as they fail to form relationships and cannot
trust.

It of course depends upon your method of measuring success or advantage.

Financial ruthlessness for example may make you rich but not necessarily
happy.

A Psychiatric nurse was caring for a so called 'Psychopath', a big and angry
person, who claimed he was the Alpha male, he had a failed business, failed
relationship with his girlfriend and a failed relationship with his Father,
he'd grown up a spoiled brat basically ... and while he paced the ward
boasting of his superor intellect and the inferiority of everyone else on
the ward.... it was the Nurse who could go home at the end of the day... the
Psychopath continued to pace the ward.

Although he didn't have a mental illness, he was on a psychiatric ward for
assessment because he was considered a danger to his ex-girlfriend... who
he'd threatened to kill because she'd dumped him.... some Alpha male.

Of course you possibly still consider his behaviour commendable.

Show me a successful Psychopath and I'll show you a hundred failures.

Regards

David.

(Interesting topic but off-topic no doubt).
 
........................


The reason Psychopaths are rarely seen in the Office of a Psychiatrist is
because it's not recognised as a mental illness, and usually falls under the
classification of personality disorder. They are usually referred via the
police.
Click to expand...

I can confirm that.
The term sociopath is a modern term for psychopath, the term sociopath is
considered more accurate and less stigmatising.
Click to expand...

No,.. it's not the same thing. That's my point. And that's what I (off
topic?) write about it. Among hackers, you have (had) some genue tech
geeks who mean no real harm, the few curious copy-cat cult-movies
adepts who think they are heroes, and the HI IQ, low SQ, some with
antisocial traits, some with a true personality disorder.

Psychopaths NEVER have contact with the police (... In fact they
often,.. well.. let's not chat about that as this is an open foum ;-).
The sociopaths do come in with the police,...
Although people with Psychopathic traits can be successful, true
psychopaths, those that have no conscious control of their pathology are
generally disadvantaged, as they fail to form relationships and cannot
trust.
Click to expand...

Right. Good knowledge. Good resumee.
It of course depends upon your method of measuring success or advantage.
Indeed.


Financial ruthlessness for example may make you rich but not necessarily
happy.
Click to expand...

Depends on the method of measuring hapiness ;-)
A Psychiatric nurse was caring for a so called 'Psychopath', a big and angry
person, who claimed he was the Alpha male, he had a failed business, failed
relationship with his girlfriend and a failed relationship with his Father,
he'd grown up a spoiled brat basically ... and while he paced the ward
boasting of his superor intellect and the inferiority of everyone else on
the ward.... it was the Nurse who could go home at the end of the day... the
Psychopath continued to pace the ward.
Click to expand...

Tell me about it.

Another story,. the nurse was called up from the central hall of the
hospital because a wild and angry crazy person was rolling on the
ground and acting extremely agressive - as the norse was told by the
receptionist. He was dressed in dirty clothes and was most certainly
dangerous. Security ans internal ambulance brought him to the ER. He
was administratively writtin in as a PSY case, the psy nurse came for
a first evaluation and found out thet the poor man had a stomach ulcer
bleeding... yes he was also a polytox, but that was not his cry for
help.
Although he didn't have a mental illness, he was on a psychiatric ward for
assessment because he was considered a danger to his ex-girlfriend... who
he'd threatened to kill because she'd dumped him.... some Alpha male.
Click to expand...

Than the go back outside the ER with the police. The police decides
what they do with the Psychopath. WHat means,.. let him go. Psychiatry
is not there so secure our society from psychopaths. A personality
disorder is not an psychiatric illness, but can accompany a major psy
ilness.
Of course you possibly still consider his behaviour commendable.

Show me a successful Psychopath and I'll show you a hundred failures.
Click to expand...

Look aroung,... you will only see the failing sociopaths,.. the
psychopaths are not visible as long as you do not cross their path.
Regards

David.

(Interesting topic but off-topic no doubt).
Click to expand...

.... I'm not really certain if it is that far off topic as we think.
But it was very interesting changing ideas with you.
I'll give you the last reply and than will let it rest 'cos I think
that i had the chance to make my point about hacking for ransom ;-)

Friendly greetings.

Carl.
 
NonDisputandum.com said:
I can confirm that.


No,.. it's not the same thing. That's my point. And that's what I (off
topic?) write about it. Among hackers, you have (had) some genue tech
geeks who mean no real harm, the few curious copy-cat cult-movies
adepts who think they are heroes, and the HI IQ, low SQ, some with
antisocial traits, some with a true personality disorder.

Psychopaths NEVER have contact with the police (... In fact they
often,.. well.. let's not chat about that as this is an open foum ;-).
The sociopaths do come in with the police,...


Right. Good knowledge. Good resumee.


Depends on the method of measuring hapiness ;-)


Tell me about it.

Another story,. the nurse was called up from the central hall of the
hospital because a wild and angry crazy person was rolling on the
ground and acting extremely agressive - as the norse was told by the
receptionist. He was dressed in dirty clothes and was most certainly
dangerous. Security ans internal ambulance brought him to the ER. He
was administratively writtin in as a PSY case, the psy nurse came for
a first evaluation and found out thet the poor man had a stomach ulcer
bleeding... yes he was also a polytox, but that was not his cry for
help.


Than the go back outside the ER with the police. The police decides
what they do with the Psychopath. WHat means,.. let him go. Psychiatry
is not there so secure our society from psychopaths. A personality
disorder is not an psychiatric illness, but can accompany a major psy
ilness.


Look aroung,... you will only see the failing sociopaths,.. the
psychopaths are not visible as long as you do not cross their path.


... I'm not really certain if it is that far off topic as we think.
But it was very interesting changing ideas with you.
I'll give you the last reply and than will let it rest 'cos I think
that i had the chance to make my point about hacking for ransom ;-)

Friendly greetings.

Carl.
Click to expand...
what they do with the Psychopath. WHat means,.. let him go. Psychiatry
is not there so secure our society from psychopaths. A personality
disorder is not an psychiatric illness, but can accompany a major psy
ilness.
Yes but they go to Psychiatric wards for assessment, the police are not
qualified for that role.

Cheers for the debate but I think your admiration is misguided, you admire
certain traits of psycopathalogy which is fine, but if a genuine psychopath
murdered one of your children or a friends child or raped your partner or a
loved one, I think your views might change.


Regards

David.
 
what they do with the Psychopath. WHat means,.. let him go. Psychiatry
is not there so secure our society from psychopaths. A personality
disorder is not an psychiatric illness, but can accompany a major psy
ilness.

Yes but they go to Psychiatric wards for assessment, the police are not
qualified for that role.

Cheers for the debate but I think your admiration is misguided, you admire
certain traits of psycopathalogy which is fine, but if a genuine psychopath
murdered one of your children or a friends child or raped your partner or a
loved one, I think your views might change.


Regards

David.






admiration is misguided
Click to expand...


Knowing about is not admiring. Your mistake & unfair to say.
Would you say that a cardiologist suffers from his heart?
 
NonDisputandum.com - 26.05.2005 14:10 :

Knowing about is not admiring. Your mistake & unfair to say.
Would you say that a cardiologist suffers from his heart?
Click to expand...

ist es wirklich notwendig, ~ 260 Zeilen voll zu quoten fuer diese 2
Zeilen? Der thread-Mitdiskutant David neigt ebenfalls zu solcher
Ueppigkeit. Sowas schaukelt sich dann in den Folgepostings schnell zu
Bandbreite fressenden Mammut-Postings/-threads auf.
 
NonDisputandum.com said:
Knowing about is not admiring. Your mistake & unfair to say.
Would you say that a cardiologist suffers from his heart?


"That is why we always will be following their trail without passing them"
Click to expand...

If I posted that Kylie had an overadapted butt, I think someone might think
I admired Kylie... then again, I wouldn't mind following in her trail... ?

Okay, I think we should end this thread before we get flamed.
 
From: "Peter Seiler" <[email protected]>

| NonDisputandum.com - 26.05.2005 14:10 :
||
| ist es wirklich notwendig, ~ 260 Zeilen voll zu quoten fuer diese 2
| Zeilen? Der thread-Mitdiskutant David neigt ebenfalls zu solcher
| Ueppigkeit. Sowas schaukelt sich dann in den Folgepostings schnell zu
| Bandbreite fressenden Mammut-Postings/-threads auf.
| --
| by(e) PS
|
| spam will be killed
|

I don't understand the post.

However, because Peter wrote it, believe I know what this is supposed to mean.
After reading many of his posts, the content is pretty much the same so this is probably a
repeat. ;-)
 
"David H. Lipman" to "David":
| http://www.cnn.com/2005/TECH/internet/05/24/internet.ransom.ap/index.html

PGPcoder Trojan (Aka, TROJ_PGPCODER.A, Virus.Win32.Gpcode.b, W32/Gopper.A ) ?
Click to expand...

Yep.

And more to the point...

It happened a week or so before someone decided they wanted the publicity and
has only been seen in a tiny, tiny number of instances.

Worse, the cub-reporter who wrote it up clearly has no grip on the reality of
anything malware-ish. Despite the general "shock and awe" tone of the article,
this is not a new threat.

1. The AIDS Trojan _disk_ incident a decade or more back had the same MO.

2. This kind of payload has been understood as a theoretical possibility
since the beginning of malware.

Had the reporter talked with anyone vaguely informed about malware and/or
involved in its history since before it became seen as a trendy thing to
work on these points should have been apparent in the report.
 
From: "Nick FitzGerald" <[email protected]>

| "David H. Lipman" to "David":
|
|>> http://www.cnn.com/2005/TECH/internet/05/24/internet.ransom.ap/index.html|
| Yep.
|
| And more to the point...
|
| It happened a week or so before someone decided they wanted the publicity and
| has only been seen in a tiny, tiny number of instances.
|
| Worse, the cub-reporter who wrote it up clearly has no grip on the reality of
| anything malware-ish. Despite the general "shock and awe" tone of the article,
| this is not a new threat.
|
| 1. The AIDS Trojan _disk_ incident a decade or more back had the same MO.
|
| 2. This kind of payload has been understood as a theoretical possibility
| since the beginning of malware.
|
| Had the reporter talked with anyone vaguely informed about malware and/or
| involved in its history since before it became seen as a trendy thing to
| work on these points should have been apparent in the report.
|
| --
| Nick FitzGerald
|

Nick:

What I found interesting, through research, is that there was a May '96 IEEE paper entitled
"Cryptovirology: extortion-based security threats and countermeasures" that predicted this.

http://ieeexplore.ieee.org/xpl/freeabs_all.jsp?arnumber=502676

The following article references that paper and goes further --
http://vx.netlux.org/lib/ayo00.html
 
David said:
If I posted that Kylie had an overadapted butt, I think someone might
think I admired Kylie... then again, I wouldn't mind following in her
trail... ?

Okay, I think we should end this thread before we get flamed.



Would you say that a cardiologist suffers from his heart?
Click to expand...

You mean like an artist suffers for his .... uhmmm sorry that's Art.

( Sorry couldn't resist)
 
David H. Lipman said:
From: "Peter Seiler" <[email protected]>

| ist es wirklich notwendig, ~ 260 Zeilen voll zu quoten fuer diese 2
| Zeilen? Der thread-Mitdiskutant David neigt ebenfalls zu solcher
| Ueppigkeit. Sowas schaukelt sich dann in den Folgepostings schnell zu
| Bandbreite fressenden Mammut-Postings/-threads auf.

I don't understand the post.

However, because Peter wrote it, believe I know what this is supposed to mean.
After reading many of his posts, the content is pretty much the same so this is
probably a repeat. ;-)
Click to expand...

Yes, "~ 260 lines of full quouting for these 2 lines?" kinda gives it
away! However, I agree with him. The other posters should be snipping!
 
David - 27.05.2005 01:56 :
You mean like an artist suffers for his .... uhmmm sorry that's Art.

( Sorry couldn't resist)
Click to expand...

about 300! quoting lines snipped

David please observe your number of quoting lines. If not absolutely
necessary (and everybody can read back) please snipp/shorten as far as
possible. THX in advance for your kind understanding.
 
From: "Peter Seiler" <[email protected]>

| NonDisputandum.com - 26.05.2005 14:10 :
|
|
| ist es wirklich notwendig, ~ 260 Zeilen voll zu quoten fuer diese 2
| Zeilen? Der thread-Mitdiskutant David neigt ebenfalls zu solcher
| Ueppigkeit. Sowas schaukelt sich dann in den Folgepostings schnell zu
| Bandbreite fressenden Mammut-Postings/-threads auf.
| --
| by(e) PS
|
| spam will be killed
|

I don't understand the post.

However, because Peter wrote it, believe I know what this is supposed to mean.
After reading many of his posts, the content is pretty much the same so this is probably a
repeat. ;-)
Click to expand...


He asked if it is really needed to quote 260 lines et tuti quanti
 
Nick said:
"David H. Lipman" to "David":


Yep.

And more to the point...

It happened a week or so before someone decided they wanted the
publicity and has only been seen in a tiny, tiny number of instances.
http://www.websensesecuritylabs.com/alerts/alert.php?AlertID=194

Worse, the cub-reporter who wrote it up clearly has no grip on the
reality of anything malware-ish. Despite the general "shock and awe"
tone of the article, this is not a new threat.

1. The AIDS Trojan _disk_ incident a decade or more back had the same
MO.

2. This kind of payload has been understood as a theoretical
possibility since the beginning of malware.

Had the reporter talked with anyone vaguely informed about malware
and/or involved in its history since before it became seen as a trendy
thing to work on these points should have been apparent in the report.
Click to expand...

Well, the sad thing is that even the trojan itself isn't new. The first
variant of the PGPcoder trojan was found in December 2004:

http://www.viruslist.com/en/weblog?discuss=156387172&return=1

The trojan mentioned in the CNN article is the second variant, but as
neither McAfee nor Symantec remember the first variant they make it look
like the second is the first one. Their names for the first variant
were:

http://www.virusbtn.com/perlbin/vgrep/vgrep.cgi?terms=GPcode&product=0

Regards,
Axel Pettinger
 
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