Can't read the OS CD in this machine,etc.

  • Thread starter Thread starter ms
  • Start date Start date
M

ms

A tech built this W2K machine for me. Very rarely do I have a problem,
but after years, it one day never got past the boot sequence, When he
worked on that problem, instead of formatting and doing a clean install,
he reinstalled over the existing OS install, thinking to make it easier
for me. Of course, it also created problems.

One surfaced recently, I seldom need the OS CD, always before, reading
the CD was OK. Since I got the machine back after the reinstall, 4 months
later, tried the OS CD. One time it did read the CD, but only one time.
But since then, I get the message "failure in reading the drive" only for
that CD. The machine still sees a music CD, data CD's that I create, etc.
It will write a new data CD, etc., so the drive is OK. But it will not
recognize the OS CD. There is nothing wrong with that CD, I had looked at
it on a XP computer.

Another problem- frequently a utility folder cannot be deleted unless
empty. I am not speaking of windows folders, but folders I create when I
unzip a utility or other application. Sometimes they delete normally, but
sometimes I have to either move the folder and then it can be deleted, or
have to delete subfolders or even files before the main folder can be
deleted. Never used to be an issue.

Advice on these issues is appreciated.

ms
 
ms said:
A tech built this W2K machine for me. Very rarely do I have a problem,
but after years, it one day never got past the boot sequence, When he
worked on that problem, instead of formatting and doing a clean install,
he reinstalled over the existing OS install, thinking to make it easier
for me. Of course, it also created problems.

One surfaced recently, I seldom need the OS CD, always before, reading
the CD was OK. Since I got the machine back after the reinstall, 4 months
later, tried the OS CD. One time it did read the CD, but only one time.
But since then, I get the message "failure in reading the drive" only for
that CD. The machine still sees a music CD, data CD's that I create, etc.
It will write a new data CD, etc., so the drive is OK. But it will not
recognize the OS CD. There is nothing wrong with that CD, I had looked at
it on a XP computer.

Another problem- frequently a utility folder cannot be deleted unless
empty. I am not speaking of windows folders, but folders I create when I
unzip a utility or other application. Sometimes they delete normally, but
sometimes I have to either move the folder and then it can be deleted, or
have to delete subfolders or even files before the main folder can be
deleted. Never used to be an issue.

Advice on these issues is appreciated.

ms
Click to expand...

See what happens when you use a burnt copy of the OS CD, made on your WinXP
PC.
 
See what happens when you use a burnt copy of the OS CD, made on your
WinXP PC.
Click to expand...

The XP machine is a used computer, first time to try to burn a CD in
that machine. I had before loaded files to it from a CD before I had a
flash card, so the CD drive basically works.

I was able to copy the W2000 OS CD, had a few error screens but did
copy all AFAIK folders and files to a new folder in XP.

When I tried to burn a new CD, with burn programs I was already
familiar with, none of them worked, common error screens were as
follows:

Device does not support buffer overrun-free recording.

Controller returns wrong size for CD capabilities page.

I plan to get into Device Manager to look at the CD drive properties.

Advice?

ms
 
ms said:
The XP machine is a used computer, first time to try to burn a CD in
that machine. I had before loaded files to it from a CD before I had a
flash card, so the CD drive basically works.

I was able to copy the W2000 OS CD, had a few error screens but did
copy all AFAIK folders and files to a new folder in XP.

When I tried to burn a new CD, with burn programs I was already
familiar with, none of them worked, common error screens were as
follows:

Device does not support buffer overrun-free recording.

Controller returns wrong size for CD capabilities page.

I plan to get into Device Manager to look at the CD drive properties.

Advice?

ms
Click to expand...

Your report is insufficiently precise to draw any firm conclusions. Here is
why:
- It is unclear which machine you used to burn a copy of the Win2000 CD.
- It is unclear whether you tried to copy files and folders or if you tried
to make a clone of the CD (which is NOT the same thing!)
- Concluding that a CD drive works because it can read the CD's files is
premature. A boot CD contains additional information that a marginal drive
may or may not process correctly.

To get to the bottom of your problem, you *must* create a clone of the
Win2000 CD on another machine. There must be *no errors* during the cloning
process. When finished, you should boot the Win2000 with this CD and report
exactly what you see.

You should also consider removing the CD drive from the WinXP machine and
connecting it to the Win2000 machine, if only temporarily.
 
Your report is insufficiently precise to draw any firm conclusions.
Here is why:
- It is unclear which machine you used to burn a copy of the Win2000
CD.
Click to expand...

On the XP machine.

- It is unclear whether you tried to copy files and folders or if
you tried to make a clone of the CD (which is NOT the same thing!)
- Concluding that a CD drive works because it can read the CD's files
is premature. A boot CD contains additional information that a
marginal drive may or may not process correctly.
Click to expand...

In the XP computer, I had copied the contents of the OS CD to a folder
on the XP computer. The copy errors occurred when I selected all to
copy, so I copied in sections of files. Still need to detect any
differences in the new folder from the OS CD.
To get to the bottom of your problem, you *must* create a clone of the
Win2000 CD on another machine. There must be *no errors* during the
cloning process. When finished, you should boot the Win2000 with this
CD and report exactly what you see.
Click to expand...
Is burning a folder as above to a blank cd what you mean by cloning a
cd?
You should also consider removing the CD drive from the WinXP machine
and connecting it to the Win2000 machine, if only temporarily.
Click to expand...

ms
 
ms said:
Is burning a folder as above to a blank cd what you mean by cloning a
cd?

You should also consider removing the CD drive from the WinXP machine
and connecting it to the Win2000 machine, if only temporarily.
Click to expand...
Click to expand...
I need to add: The CD/DVD drive in my W2000 machine is fine, it always
used to see the OS CD, now this is the only CD it does not read. The
only change was the reinstall of windows.

IMO the issue is with the CD, and I will search for answers to the
error messages on the drive in the other XP machine. It's not easy for
me to swap drives unless absolutely necessary.

Please comment, and thanks for the help.

ms
 
ms said:
I need to add: The CD/DVD drive in my W2000 machine is fine, it always
used to see the OS CD, now this is the only CD it does not read. The
only change was the reinstall of windows.

IMO the issue is with the CD
Click to expand...
ms
Click to expand...

.. . . I agree, and this is why I recommended that you burn a copy of this CD
on some other machine.
 
. . . I agree, and this is why I recommended that you burn a copy of
this CD on some other machine.
Click to expand...

I ran the XP machine. I'm no expert, but even I know Device Manager
can be misleading, it says the CD driver is XP default driver, the CD
drive is a Sony, don't know if that is the issue.

I searched for the error messages. Regarding buffer underrun, advice
was to increase more RAM and unload the memory, this machine has 384
MB RAM which in my world is a good number. The memory used is 43%,
lots of free memory. Also was advised to lower burn speed.

I tried again with burn speed set to 1, in other machines (W2K and
W98) I typically burn at Max and it works fine. I used a program that
works fine in other machines, got buffer underrun error again.

Tried a different program, got the "Controller returns wrong size"
error message.

I will transfer the OS folder with a flash card and try this in a
known W98 machine. I will report back.

ms
 
Sounds like you're just copying the file/folder structure which won't work.
You need to use the disk copy function of your burning software.



--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
Sounds like you're just copying the file/folder structure which won't
work. You need to use the disk copy function of your burning software.
Click to expand...
I copied the OS CD to a folder in XP. But can't burn that folder to a
CD in that machine, The programs I have for creating/burning CD's
don't copy, AFAIK.

BTW, what is a good way to check that the files in my copied folder
are an exact copy of the files on the OS CD?

ms
 
For most burning software you tell it you want to do a "disk copy" then
follow the prompts. Copying the disk structure won't work.


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
For most burning software you tell it you want to do a "disk copy" then
follow the prompts. Copying the disk structure won't work.
Click to expand...
As a senior, bad sleep causes this: I finally realized what Pegasus
and yourself were saying. I believe you folks are talking about
creating an *image* of the CD. I do have software that does that, have
not done that before, will look into it and post back.

One thing I have to do on the XP computer first is defrag.
Dave, IIRC, about 6 months ago there was a thread in which you, I
think, said leave the registry alone, don't defrag. I this week came
across in my saved data a post from you dated 2005 where you
recommended to someone to defrag. I don't defrag my W2000 machine and
it works fine. I know in W98SE, regular defrag is necessary.

In my XP case, one of the corrective measures to prevent buffer
underrun is defrag, and there I will do it.

Please comment on the above.

Also, could you address my previous question about:
what is a good way to check that the files in my copied folder
are an exact copy of the files on the OS CD?

Thanks to all for the help.

ms
 
ms said:
As a senior, bad sleep causes this: I finally realized what Pegasus
and yourself were saying. I believe you folks are talking about
creating an *image* of the CD. I do have software that does that, have
not done that before, will look into it and post back.
Click to expand...

Actually, no they are not. An "image" of a CD is a file, with a .iso (or
other) extension which is created from the CD and from which, with the
appropriate software, you can burn an exact copy of the CD. While you
could do that in this case, it's an extra step that you really don't need.

What Dave and Pegasus are talking about is directly making an exact copy
of the CD. A bootable CD has hidden "boot sector" (for want of a better
name) files on it. If you simply use XCopy to copy the visible files
from the CD to your HD and then burn a CD from them you miss these
hidden files and their associated disc structure so the resulting CD is
not a direct copy of the original and will not be bootable.

However, any CD/DVD authoring application worthy of the name (Nero, ECDC
etc ... even the Lite versions given away with OEM drives) includes the
ability to make direct 1:1 copies of an original disk in a similar
manner to copying, say, a floppy disk.
 
Actually, no they are not. An "image" of a CD is a file, with a .iso
(or other) extension which is created from the CD and from which, with
the appropriate software, you can burn an exact copy of the CD. While
you could do that in this case, it's an extra step that you really
don't need.

What Dave and Pegasus are talking about is directly making an exact
copy of the CD. A bootable CD has hidden "boot sector" (for want of a
better name) files on it. If you simply use XCopy to copy the visible
files from the CD to your HD and then burn a CD from them you miss
these hidden files and their associated disc structure so the
resulting CD is not a direct copy of the original and will not be
bootable.

However, any CD/DVD authoring application worthy of the name (Nero,
ECDC etc ... even the Lite versions given away with OEM drives)
includes the ability to make direct 1:1 copies of an original disk in
a similar manner to copying, say, a floppy disk.
Click to expand...

Thanks.

I will look into it, may be a little while, but I will report back.

ms
 
ms said:
As a senior, bad sleep causes this: I finally realized what Pegasus
and yourself were saying. I believe you folks are talking about
creating an *image* of the CD. I do have software that does that, have
not done that before, will look into it and post back.
Click to expand...
*** Yes, create an exact image.

One thing I have to do on the XP computer first is defrag.
Dave, IIRC, about 6 months ago there was a thread in which you, I
think, said leave the registry alone, don't defrag.
Click to expand...
*** This was probably in reference to some "registry cleaner"


I this week came
across in my saved data a post from you dated 2005 where you
recommended to someone to defrag. I don't defrag my W2000 machine and
it works fine. I know in W98SE, regular defrag is necessary.

In my XP case, one of the corrective measures to prevent buffer
underrun is defrag, and there I will do it.

Please comment on the above.

Also, could you address my previous question about:
what is a good way to check that the files in my copied folder
are an exact copy of the files on the OS CD?
Click to expand...
*** You can use windiff.exe
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/159214


--

Regards,

Dave Patrick ....Please no email replies - reply in newsgroup.
Microsoft Certified Professional
Microsoft MVP [Windows]
http://www.microsoft.com/protect
 
You can download it from the link I provided though it probably doesn't
matter.
Click to expand...

I did try that link. It installs. I install only whats really needed
on my W2000 machine. So this was installed on a W98 machine and copied
back to my W2k machine. It was supposed to include the Nt windiff.exe.
I looked in the resulting cab file and no windiff.

Anyway, below is 2 versions of windiff, one of which I plan to use.
Both of them have the same opening screen.
-----------------
Windiff.exe from W2000
http://www.petri.co.il/download_free_reskit_tools.htm
85264 bytes, 3/12/99
MD5: 489B84687FE56FBCDEE7E2891D73A96C
---------------------
Windiff.exe from W98
147680 bytes, 4/23/99
MD5: B1A37D9A3A20F259A7ED0F493017E6C6

The "older" version from W98 has a newer file date and a bigger file
size than the W2000 version.

Advice?

ms
 
Dunno. I'm not clear on why you're even doing this.
Click to expand...
You had suggested Windiff, and I have been searching/gathering data on
using it,

But since there are version differences, I figure you are familiar
with it and can recommend which to use.

ms
 
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