ATI loses bus license from Intel

  • Thread starter Thread starter Yousuf Khan
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Carlo said:
According to the daily tech the agreement is still in place:

http://dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=3494
Click to expand...

Looks like Intel is still trying to grapple with the issue. It's a
highly emotion-driven company, and it's probably in the middle of its
laughing and crying stage right now.

It got all uptight when somebody asked about ATI being locked out of
the Conroe launch.

"Sean Maloney, Intel senior vice president for sales and marketing, cut
in and said: "Listen, this is a big day for us here ... what kind of a
question is that? No, the rumors are not true ... there are about five
ATI systems out there right now ..." His voice trailed off."
http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1995545,00.asp

But were ATI systems de-emphasized or reduced in number from before?

Row flares over ATI's role at Conroe launch
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=33323
 
Looks like Intel is still trying to grapple with the issue. It's a
highly emotion-driven company, and it's probably in the middle of its
laughing and crying stage right now.

It got all uptight when somebody asked about ATI being locked out of
the Conroe launch.

"Sean Maloney, Intel senior vice president for sales and marketing, cut
in and said: "Listen, this is a big day for us here ... what kind of a
question is that? No, the rumors are not true ... there are about five
ATI systems out there right now ..." His voice trailed off."
http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1995545,00.asp

But were ATI systems de-emphasized or reduced in number from before?

Row flares over ATI's role at Conroe launch
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=33323
Click to expand...

I was at the launch after the journalists and analysts left, and I saw
about an even mix of SLI (dual and quad) and Crossfire systems. I
didn't pay much attention to the lesser boxes, so can't speak for the
single-board systems.

The box that was claimed to be the most powerful had quad SLI and a
Core 2 Duo Extreme CPU, with water cooling shared by CPU and GPUs.
Even with big watercooled heatsinks, the quad SLI cards were giving
off considerable heat, while the heatsink on the CPU was cool to the
touch.

The demo guy for this box was repeatedly asked about the aggressive
CPU cooling for a chip marketed as lower power, and he replied that
the CPU wasn't overclocked, but the system was marketed towards people
who wanted to be able to overclock.

Nobody I spoke to seemed particularly concerned about what GPUs were
used, but the CPUs were the focus of the day, after all.
 
Looks like Intel is still trying to grapple with the issue. It's a
highly emotion-driven company, and it's probably in the middle of its
laughing and crying stage right now.

It got all uptight when somebody asked about ATI being locked out of
the Conroe launch.

"Sean Maloney, Intel senior vice president for sales and marketing, cut
in and said: "Listen, this is a big day for us here ... what kind of a
question is that? No, the rumors are not true ... there are about five
ATI systems out there right now ..." His voice trailed off."
http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1995545,00.asp
Click to expand...

This article is full of errors. I guess he didn't have his tape
recorder going. He totally bungled every quote in the article,
paraphrasing everyone in a way that supported the article's theme.

For the most obvious parts, Otellini didn't glare when asked about the
whether he saw elements of graphics going into the microprocessor, he
glanced at Maloney, then smiled after he answered, and joked about it
on the next question, getting a laugh from the audience. He also
didn't say "Next question". Maloney, while irked, didn't say "What
kind of question is that? No, the rumors are not true", and his voice
didn't trail off - he said "There are 5 ATI systems out there" in a
strong way, ending with a "You connect the dots" shrug.

The guy who wrote this article is obviously spinning it from a faulty
memory. That's the polite version, anyway.

max
 
Looks like Intel is still trying to grapple with the issue. It's a
highly emotion-driven company, and it's probably in the middle of its
laughing and crying stage right now.
Click to expand...

One thing I've been wondering about in this: does Intel need a license from
ATI to make Crossfire work with the i975 chipset? That'd kinda complicate
things and cheer up nVidia rather nicely.:-)
It got all uptight when somebody asked about ATI being locked out of
the Conroe launch.

"Sean Maloney, Intel senior vice president for sales and marketing, cut
in and said: "Listen, this is a big day for us here ... what kind of a
question is that? No, the rumors are not true ... there are about five
ATI systems out there right now ..." His voice trailed off."
http://www.eweek.com/article2/0,1895,1995545,00.asp

But were ATI systems de-emphasized or reduced in number from before?

Row flares over ATI's role at Conroe launch
http://www.theinquirer.net/default.aspx?article=33323
Click to expand...

Since ATI was "kicked off the stage"... seems like that satisfies
"de-emphasized" - no?:-) What a petty, puerile move from an industry umm,
giant. Now they'll have to remove all that buck-shot from their feet.
 
George said:
Since ATI was "kicked off the stage"... seems like that satisfies
"de-emphasized" - no?:-) What a petty, puerile move from an industry umm,
giant. Now they'll have to remove all that buck-shot from their feet.
Click to expand...

Even if the reporter's take on Intel's reactions isn't right, as some of
the Intel folks around here are saying, just the fact that ATI was
pulled out of the onstage demos is quite telling.

Yousuf Khan
 
max said:
This article is full of errors. I guess he didn't have his tape
recorder going. He totally bungled every quote in the article,
paraphrasing everyone in a way that supported the article's theme.
Click to expand...

Okay, be that as it may, if reporters are taking liberties with their
stories, then do you have an explanation for this story?

PC World PC World's Techlog
http://blogs.pcworld.com/techlog/archives/002494.html
PC World's Harry McCracken:

"For me, though, the most memorable moment of the morning was a completely unexpected one. The event kicked off with a speech by Intel CEO Paul Ottelini in which he talked, among other things, about the era in which the CPU wars were about clockspeed. To make his point, he had a slide in which he showed covers of old computer magazines, going all the way back to the days when a 90-MHz machine was a hot rod.

Here's the slide (which is a bit fuzzy because it's a still from a video I shot with my little Canon Elph)

I wasn't surprised by the old covers, since we'd given Intel some images of old PCWs to help them out. But I was startled, to say the least, by that PC World on the far right, showing the January, 2003 issue with its great big "First 3-GHz PCs for 2003" line.

How come I was flummoxed by a PCW cover? Well, we never did that one. Here's the real January, 2003 issue, which did mention 3-Ghz PCs, but as a text-only line above our logo."
Click to expand...

Sounds like liberties with the truth are being taken all around here,
doesn't it?

Yousuf Khan
 
Okay, be that as it may, if reporters are taking liberties with their
stories, then do you have an explanation for this story?

PC World PC World's Techlog
http://blogs.pcworld.com/techlog/archives/002494.html
Click to expand...

Not all journalists are careless with their facts. Many use due
diligence, and can even be relatively unbiased. I actually know some
like that.

This appears to be a factual article, backed up by expertise and data,
where marketing's been caught re-purposing a line on a 3.5 year old
magazine cover, found by one of the few people who would notice or
care about such a thing. Nice job by Mr. McCracken, who gives them
the benefit of the doubt, to his greater credit. We could use more
journalists like that.

Sounds like liberties with the truth are being taken all around here,
doesn't it?
Click to expand...

Call me old-fashioned, but putting words someone didn't say between
quotation marks is a fairly major journalistic no-no. I'm not sure
I'd compare it to marketeers changing the font size and focus of a
line on an old magazine cover in an eye-candy slide, but I hold
journalists to a higher standard than marketeers.

max
 
George Macdonald said:
Since ATI was "kicked off the stage"... seems like that satisfies
"de-emphasized" - no?:-) What a petty, puerile move from an industry umm,
giant. Now they'll have to remove all that buck-shot from their feet.
Click to expand...

To the best of my knowledge, the answer is yes. From what I understand ATI
was able to use the Intel bus under a cross licensing agreement with ATI,
which also allowed Intel to build CrossFire support into their chipsets. So
if Intel decides to kick AMD/ATI out of thier market, then presumably they
would no longer be able to produce crossfire capable boards. Then they would
perhaps move on to building SLI capable chipsets.

Carlo
 
max said:
Not all journalists are careless with their facts. Many use due
diligence, and can even be relatively unbiased. I actually know some
like that.

This appears to be a factual article, backed up by expertise and data,
where marketing's been caught re-purposing a line on a 3.5 year old
magazine cover, found by one of the few people who would notice or
care about such a thing. Nice job by Mr. McCracken, who gives them
the benefit of the doubt, to his greater credit. We could use more
journalists like that.
Click to expand...

Great, I'm glad you approve. Now back to the issue at hand.
Call me old-fashioned, but putting words someone didn't say between
quotation marks is a fairly major journalistic no-no. I'm not sure
I'd compare it to marketeers changing the font size and focus of a
line on an old magazine cover in an eye-candy slide, but I hold
journalists to a higher standard than marketeers.
Click to expand...

So basically what you're saying in your ever so political way is that
it's okay for Intel marketeers to put their own emotional tilt on the
facts as put out by journalists, but it's not okay for journalists to do
the same on the facts as put out by Intel?

Yousuf Khan
 
Great, I'm glad you approve. Now back to the issue at hand.


So basically what you're saying in your ever so political way is that
it's okay for Intel marketeers to put their own emotional tilt on the
facts as put out by journalists, but it's not okay for journalists to do
the same on the facts as put out by Intel?
Click to expand...

I didn't say it was OK, I said I hold journalists to a higher standard
than marketeers. A marketeer's job is to present data in a biased
way. Some journalists perform their jobs this way as well, but the
responsible ones (both marketeers and journalists) stick with actual
facts and don't make stuff up, even when they only present one aspect
of the facts.

I expect journalists to present facts, even when they're spinning,
which wasn't the case in the article cited. I simply corrected the
erroneous statements, and that's a time-honored csiphc tradition, as
you know.

max
 
Not all journalists are careless with their facts. Many use due
diligence, and can even be relatively unbiased. I actually know some
like that.

This appears to be a factual article, backed up by expertise and data,
where marketing's been caught re-purposing a line on a 3.5 year old
magazine cover, found by one of the few people who would notice or
care about such a thing. Nice job by Mr. McCracken, who gives them
the benefit of the doubt, to his greater credit. We could use more
journalists like that.
Click to expand...

"Repurposing"? That's quite a euphemistic stretch for obliterating a cover
headline and replacing it with a blown up version of a minor line from
elsewhere on the same page.

As for "benefit of the doubt", I don't see that at all. He caught them
with a lie - he took their pants down publicly... but politely. He's a
gentleman. said:
Call me old-fashioned, but putting words someone didn't say between
quotation marks is a fairly major journalistic no-no. I'm not sure
I'd compare it to marketeers changing the font size and focus of a
line on an old magazine cover in an eye-candy slide, but I hold
journalists to a higher standard than marketeers.
Click to expand...

Oh so marketeers are expected to create bloody great lies by forging a
redesign of a magazine cover? "Changing the font size and focus" does not
cover it fer chrissakes - they discarded and rewrote the headline. Sorry
but this reeks of disrespect, contempt even, for everybody including the
magazine publisher... and we're supposed to greet their coy titters when
discovered with an understanding shrug? No, not me - one's as bad as the
other from my POV.
 
To the best of my knowledge, the answer is yes. From what I understand ATI
was able to use the Intel bus under a cross licensing agreement with ATI,
which also allowed Intel to build CrossFire support into their chipsets. So
if Intel decides to kick AMD/ATI out of thier market, then presumably they
would no longer be able to produce crossfire capable boards. Then they would
perhaps move on to building SLI capable chipsets.
Click to expand...

Hmm, I think you selected the wrong half of my post to quote.:-) It should
have been this:

At any rate, it would be a big gamble for Intel to have to forgo future ATI
video chips. AIUI, ATI has already moved some ways towards a CPU type
design -- more custom logic -- and collaboration with AMD *could* lead to
substantial gains in performance down the road.
 
George Macdonald said:
Hmm, I think you selected the wrong half of my post to quote.:-) It
should
have been this:
Click to expand...

Ah yes, I suppose this happens when you're not paying close enough attention
to which part of the post you delete. Opps.
At any rate, it would be a big gamble for Intel to have to forgo future
ATI
video chips. AIUI, ATI has already moved some ways towards a CPU type
design -- more custom logic -- and collaboration with AMD *could* lead to
substantial gains in performance down the road.
Click to expand...

Yeah, hopefully we'll something like that... Current state of affairs in the
domain of x86 cpu production is interesting to say the least... Intel is
starting to copy typical AMD stratagies and AMD is copying the typical Intel
ones. Perhaps with a little luck we'll end up somewhere in the middle with
the best of both worlds. I'm sure that's probably a little more to hope for,
in fact there's probably a much better chance that one of my powerball
tickets will win me a cool $180M. But hey, you never know.

Carlo
 
"Repurposing"? That's quite a euphemistic stretch for obliterating a cover
headline and replacing it with a blown up version of a minor line from
elsewhere on the same page.
Click to expand...

Whatever. It's a bit shorter than your phrase, but I'm easy.
As for "benefit of the doubt", I don't see that at all. He caught them
with a lie - he took their pants down publicly... but politely. He's a
gentleman.<shrug>
Click to expand...

The neutrality was what I was referring to. He didn't attempt to call
BS on their "overzealous graphics specialist" explanation, leaving it
up to the reader to reach their own conclusion. He reported the facts
as he received them, without spinning them. It's a good trait in a
journalist.
Oh so marketeers are expected to create bloody great lies by forging a
redesign of a magazine cover? "Changing the font size and focus" does not
cover it fer chrissakes - they discarded and rewrote the headline. Sorry
but this reeks of disrespect, contempt even, for everybody including the
magazine publisher... and we're supposed to greet their coy titters when
discovered with an understanding shrug? No, not me - one's as bad as the
other from my POV.
Click to expand...

A marketeer emphasizing one line over another as bad to you as a
journalist making up/incorrectly documenting things? Well, that's a
personal preference, I suppose.

I never believe anything marketeers say without reviewing the source
data, while journalists are, in theory, one of our primary data
sources.

The marketeer's job, as I stated in another post, is to present biased
data to make a particular point. I've never known one to tell the
whole truth, and many lie outright.

Personally, I think it was a stupid trick, particularly given how
pointless the change was, and how little the slide had to do with
anything. Neither version of the cover actually mentioned Intel, and
the odds that people would pay any attention to a slide of 3 to 13
year old magazine covers makes it even more foolish.

Add to that the extreme unlikelihood that these slides weren't
carefully vetted by the graphics specialist's boss, and it just
doesn't make any sense. There was no gain in it for anybody, only
downside.

Still, in the overall scheme of things, it's hard for me to get too
worked up over it. YMMV, as always.

max
 
George said:
Oh so marketeers are expected to create bloody great lies by forging a
redesign of a magazine cover? "Changing the font size and focus" does not
cover it fer chrissakes - they discarded and rewrote the headline. Sorry
but this reeks of disrespect, contempt even, for everybody including the
magazine publisher... and we're supposed to greet their coy titters when
discovered with an understanding shrug? No, not me - one's as bad as the
other from my POV.
Click to expand...

I mean replacing a headline with a minor by-line is just one step
removed from quoting out of context. I mean a quote like: "The mayor
admits to hitting the town with his wife", can be doctored to "The mayor
admits to hitting his wife". What's the big deal there? Most of the
words were carried over, a few selective deletions for space savings
considerations, it's the same thing, right?

Yousuf Khan
 
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