ASUS A7N8X deluxe - dead or not?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Red Fox
  • Start date Start date
R

Red Fox

Hi Experts,

Problem: ASUS A7N8X deluxe - 3 years old with AMD Athlon processor.

This is a machine I built myself and it ran ok until about six months ago
when the kbd connection failed. A USB replacement worked fine. Finally it
would not start at all. The board's power led was lit. There were no Bios
beeps. The cpu fan and drives were running. No response to pressing the
delete key and no video output at all.
What I tried:

1 Inspected the board for burn spots, bent pins, bloated capacitors.
2 Removed all cards except the video.
3 Used a PC Power and Cooling gadget to check the power supply and it was
ok.
4 Checked CMOS battery and it had about 2.5 volts, which may be low.
5 Tried different memory sticks and video cards.
6 Replaced the CPU with a new Athlon and again it failed to boot up.

Other suggestions appreciated.

TIA

RF
 
Hi Experts,

Problem: ASUS A7N8X deluxe - 3 years old with AMD Athlon processor.
Click to expand...

At this age, low quality fans (if you have any) may be worn
quite a bit, check to see if all are still working.

This is a machine I built myself and it ran ok until about six months ago
when the kbd connection failed. A USB replacement worked fine. Finally it
would not start at all. The board's power led was lit. There were no Bios
beeps. The cpu fan and drives were running. No response to pressing the
delete key and no video output at all.
Click to expand...

If you have an old PCI video card, try temporarily using it
and removing the AGP card.


What I tried:

1 Inspected the board for burn spots, bent pins, bloated capacitors.
Click to expand...

If all else fails, also unplug the PSU from AC power for
several minutes then open and inspect it similarly. One of
the more common longer-term problems with a board that uses
5V rail PSU power for the CPU power subcircuit is that it is
hard on the PSU capacitors, especially those on the 5V rail
near where the wiring harness attaches to the board, meaning
you might have to move those wires out of the way some to
see all the capacitors.

2 Removed all cards except the video.
Click to expand...

Also remove all but one memory module, though it is less
likely to make a difference now with a formerly stable
system than with one that started out incapable of more
memory. Also, IIRC the board has a jumper for FSB speed,
try putting that in the slower of the two settings. Also
try clearing CMOS while AC power is disconnected.

3 Used a PC Power and Cooling gadget to check the power supply and it was
ok.
Click to expand...

Unfortunately it can't tell you that the PSU is working
properly to power the system, rather it can only find
specific kinds of faults.

What make, model, wattage, and rated capacity of 3V+5V power
is this PSU? "IF" you end up needing to replace the PSU, it
would be best to choose a quality name-brand PSU rated for
at least 200W of combined 3V+5V power.

4 Checked CMOS battery and it had about 2.5 volts, which may be low.
Click to expand...

Yes, and I vaguely recall that this motherboard will not
POST if the battery is too low. Replacing the battery
should be priority #1.

5 Tried different memory sticks and video cards.
6 Replaced the CPU with a new Athlon and again it failed to boot up.
Click to expand...

Try the things suggested and go from there. I suggest you
reinstall the original CPU unless the heatsink fan had
failed or the system was turned on while there was no
heatsink on it... because it was known working and would not
typically fail without some very obvious problem causing it.
As for the memory I suggest using only one of the modules
that had been in it while it was working fine.
 
Thanks Kony for the great reply.

kony said:
At this age, low quality fans (if you have any) may be worn
quite a bit, check to see if all are still working.
Click to expand...

The heatsink fan should be ok. It was an AMD fan that came with the original
CPU chip. The fan rotor is a little loose and it makes some noise but it
blows as good as ever.
If you have an old PCI video card, try temporarily using it
and removing the AGP card.
Click to expand...

I already replaced the Radeon 9000 video card with a very recent Gigabyte
GV-N66128DP.
As you suggested I'll try a PCI card tomorrow.
If all else fails, also unplug the PSU from AC power for
several minutes then open and inspect it similarly. One of
the more common longer-term problems with a board that uses
5V rail PSU power for the CPU power subcircuit is that it is
hard on the PSU capacitors, especially those on the 5V rail
near where the wiring harness attaches to the board, meaning
you might have to move those wires out of the way some to
see all the capacitors.
Click to expand...

I'll have a close look there tomorrow.
Also remove all but one memory module, though it is less
likely to make a difference now with a formerly stable
system than with one that started out incapable of more
memory. Also, IIRC the board has a jumper for FSB speed,
try putting that in the slower of the two settings. Also
try clearing CMOS while AC power is disconnected.
Click to expand...

Will do that tomorrow.
Unfortunately it can't tell you that the PSU is working
properly to power the system, rather it can only find
specific kinds of faults.

What make, model, wattage, and rated capacity of 3V+5V power
is this PSU? "IF" you end up needing to replace the PSU, it
would be best to choose a quality name-brand PSU rated for
at least 200W of combined 3V+5V power.
Click to expand...

First, before I tested the Enlight EN-8361934 (Model HPC-360-102) 360W PSU,
I opened it, cleared out some dust but there seemed no trace of overheating
or anything bad.
DC output: 5V x 35A. 3.3V x 28A = 220W.
Yes, and I vaguely recall that this motherboard will not
POST if the battery is too low. Replacing the battery
should be priority #1.
Click to expand...

Will do that soon.
Try the things suggested and go from there. I suggest you
reinstall the original CPU unless the heatsink fan had
failed or the system was turned on while there was no
heatsink on it... because it was known working and would not
typically fail without some very obvious problem causing it.
As for the memory I suggest using only one of the modules
that had been in it while it was working fine.
Click to expand...

The memory modules were already reduced to one. Will make the numerous
changes suggested and then will replace the original CPU and fan, if the new
one doesn't boot up.

I tried a two more things this afternoon and had interesting results.

I replaced the PSU with an Enlight 250W and the results were the same as
before - not a beep from the Bios. This PSU was weaker with a max of 125W
for the 3.5 and 5V DC. All I had connected was one FD and one HD and I ran
it for about 30-40 seconds only.

Next, I replaced the motherboard with a new PCChips M848A and the new Athlon
and the results were exactly the same as the other situations. Not a beep
nor an attempt to boot up.

Have a great week :-)

RF
 
On Sun, 12 Aug 2007 22:16:08 -0700, "Red Fox"

First, before I tested the Enlight EN-8361934 (Model HPC-360-102) 360W PSU,
I opened it, cleared out some dust but there seemed no trace of overheating
or anything bad.
DC output: 5V x 35A. 3.3V x 28A = 220W.
Click to expand...

Unless you have a very power hungry video card installed,
that PSU should be sufficient for powering the system from a
capacity standpoint, but I vaguely recall that this PSU has
a known flaw. It (unless they revised the design to correct
the mistake) has a load resistor inside that is installed
too close to a capacitor or two and sometimes even cemeted
to an adjacent capacitor. The heat generated by the load
resistor then overheats the capacitor and causes early
failure.

It might not be the problem you're having, but I would think
failing PSU capacitors is one of the most likely problems
(but even so, the rest of my suggestions are still things I
would check if the PSU caps look ok).

The memory modules were already reduced to one. Will make the numerous
changes suggested and then will replace the original CPU and fan, if the new
one doesn't boot up.
Click to expand...

For the time being I would leave the original CPU installed,
it is not likely to be the problem.

I tried a two more things this afternoon and had interesting results.

I replaced the PSU with an Enlight 250W and the results were the same as
before - not a beep from the Bios. This PSU was weaker with a max of 125W
for the 3.5 and 5V DC. All I had connected was one FD and one HD and I ran
it for about 30-40 seconds only.
Click to expand...

It would be good to try a more powerful PSU because 125W of
3.3V+5V combined power is probably not enough. I have owned
(and probably still have it around here somewhere) an
A7N8X-Dlx and had been powering it with a PSU with about
230W of 3.3V+5V capacity rating. Unfortunately today many
of the higher wattage new PSU models having a high total
wattage rating, have most of those watts as amps on the 12V
rail instead of the 5V rail. Therefore, the most cost
effective PSU replacement (if it comes to that) would be an
older model.
Next, I replaced the motherboard with a new PCChips M848A and the new Athlon
and the results were exactly the same as the other situations. Not a beep
nor an attempt to boot up.
Click to expand...

I would try a different PSU with this CPU/board combination
too, as M848A similarly requires a high 5V current from the
PSU. Motherboards with lower 5V current requirements use
12V rail to power the CPU subcircuit via a 2x2, 4-pin 12V
connector. However, your Enlight 360W (If and when it is
working correctly) is more optimal for powering a 5V based
board than the 12V based... it would just be easier to find
a brand new model PSU to power the 12V based type of board.
 
kony said:
On Sun, 12 Aug 2007 22:16:08 -0700, "Red Fox"



Unless you have a very power hungry video card installed,
that PSU should be sufficient for powering the system from a
capacity standpoint, but I vaguely recall that this PSU has
a known flaw. It (unless they revised the design to correct
the mistake) has a load resistor inside that is installed
too close to a capacitor or two and sometimes even cemeted
to an adjacent capacitor. The heat generated by the load
resistor then overheats the capacitor and causes early
failure.

It might not be the problem you're having, but I would think
failing PSU capacitors is one of the most likely problems
(but even so, the rest of my suggestions are still things I
Click to expand...

You are right on this point. I opened the 360W PSU again and, as you
suggested, I pulled the cables away from the 4 tall capacitors just inside
where the cables were located. Three of them were green and one was black.
This black one looks peculiar. It is not quite round. It seems like it
bulged out and pressed against one of the green ones giving a surface that
is parallel to the surface of the green one for about 3/16". I don't see any
point in making a capacitor any shape except round and this one is not
round. So it looks like a dead capacitor and a dead PSU. Can you recommend a
good quality PSU?
For the time being I would leave the original CPU installed,
it is not likely to be the problem.
ok


It would be good to try a more powerful PSU because 125W of
3.3V+5V combined power is probably not enough. I have owned
(and probably still have it around here somewhere) an
A7N8X-Dlx and had been powering it with a PSU with about
230W of 3.3V+5V capacity rating. Unfortunately today many
of the higher wattage new PSU models having a high total
wattage rating, have most of those watts as amps on the 12V
rail instead of the 5V rail. Therefore, the most cost
effective PSU replacement (if it comes to that) would be an
older model.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the info. Again, from your experience, what would be a good PSU
for this situation?
I'm looking for some PSU ratings.
I would try a different PSU with this CPU/board combination
too, as M848A similarly requires a high 5V current from the
PSU. Motherboards with lower 5V current requirements use
12V rail to power the CPU subcircuit via a 2x2, 4-pin 12V
connector. However, your Enlight 360W (If and when it is
working correctly) is more optimal for powering a 5V based
board than the 12V based... it would just be easier to find
a brand new model PSU to power the 12V based type of board.
Click to expand...

I'm looking for this PSU.

I'm also thinking of buying an Intel D845GEBV2 motherboard and it seems to
have a square 12V connection, in addition to the usual 10 pin-hole socket.
It would seem this board requires two sets of cables from the PSU, somthing
I have not seen before.

Thanks for all your help.

RF
 
You are right on this point. I opened the 360W PSU again and, as you
suggested, I pulled the cables away from the 4 tall capacitors just inside
where the cables were located. Three of them were green and one was black.
This black one looks peculiar. It is not quite round. It seems like it
bulged out and pressed against one of the green ones giving a surface that
is parallel to the surface of the green one for about 3/16".
Click to expand...


Are you sure it is a capacitor instead of an inductor?
Hold on a second while I see if I have any pictures of that
design [ ;-) ].
....

Ok, I don't have a picture of the 360W but I do of the 340W
which I believe is the same design with minimal changes.
Unfortunately the wiring harness isn't pulled out of the
way, but I "think" I may have one of these still because it
had to be repaired (different problem, power surge blew out
a high voltage transistor). picture is ~ 500KB

http://69.36.166.207/usr_1034/HPC-340_enlight_highpower_sirtec.jpg

If yours is like this and you can indicate on the picture
where it is, I can check the one I have here. Maybe your
description is dead-on, that it's a cap, but I had doubts
because of the way you worded it and a bad cap generally
stays round while there are definitely a few inductors
around these capacitors and they're roughly the same size.
All the caps have aluminum colored metal tops while the
inductors will have black tops. Well, all the caps except
any which have vented out the top which will look more tan
or darkish crusty colored. For example,
http://www.jebswebsite.com/misc_pics/ibm_mobo_capacitors.jpg
I don't see any
point in making a capacitor any shape except round and this one is not
round.
Click to expand...

Unless a capacitor has a defective top vent and is cemented
down at the base (in which case they may completely explode
leaving what looks like shards of paper and foil all over,
usually shutting down the PSU completely), the two main
visual cues are that it has slanted at a funny angle with
the rubber plug on the bottom extended out of the metal
casing, or the flat top has bulged outwards in a dome shape,
and of course electrolyte leakage at the top or bottom but
that might have turned to a rough crusty looking substance
(not to be confused with the cement they used to secure
parts in place, which started out light tan or white but may
darken with time^heat..

So it looks like a dead capacitor and a dead PSU. Can you recommend a
good quality PSU?
Click to expand...

Depends on the budget, how much risk you want to take. The
cheapest thing I might try would be an Ultra V-Series 400W
or 500W, which are often nearly free after rebate at
Frys.com or Radio Shack. They aren't the best quality
though, a good median quality unit would be a
Sparkle/Fortron 350-400W but not their newest series which
have more 12V, less 5V current capacity, rather an older
model like
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817104931
(or even better, their next higher wattage unit isn't just
worth 50W more, it has a better build quality too
(FSP400-60PFN)

If you wanted to reuse the psu you buy with your next system
upgrade, instead of these you should be looking at a high
wattage modern PSU - but unless your next system is very
power hungry, it can practically cost as much to buy that
very high wattage PSU to get enough 5V current, as it would
for a more normal wattage for your present system then again
a more normal wattage for the next system /parts.


I'm also thinking of buying an Intel D845GEBV2 motherboard and it seems to
have a square 12V connection, in addition to the usual 10 pin-hole socket.
It would seem this board requires two sets of cables from the PSU, somthing
I have not seen before.
Click to expand...


Yes, you would want a more modern PSU optimized towards
supplying more 12V current to power that, not your Enlight
and not the Sparkle/Fortrons I mentioned above. In other
words, this board would not need anywhere near the suggested
200W of combined 3.3V+5V power, but ideally you would shoot
for a PSU trusted to be able to provide at least 14-16A of
12V power (even more if running a lot of hard drives or a
higher powered gaming video card). Typically for a modern
system 18A @ 12V is considered median value and a little
more, a little better.

If you happened to have soldering skills and it is a bad cap
in your psu, you might just consider replacing the cap(s).
Takes about a half hour to disassemble and do it (and you'd
need a beefy soldering iron, in case they've flooded the
bottom of the board with solder as I don't recall this
aspect on the Enlights).
 
kony said:
You are right on this point. I opened the 360W PSU again and, as you
suggested, I pulled the cables away from the 4 tall capacitors just inside
where the cables were located. Three of them were green and one was black.
This black one looks peculiar. It is not quite round. It seems like it
bulged out and pressed against one of the green ones giving a surface that
is parallel to the surface of the green one for about 3/16".
Click to expand...


Are you sure it is a capacitor instead of an inductor?
Hold on a second while I see if I have any pictures of that
design [ ;-) ].
Click to expand...

Sorry, I have to take that back. I just got a very bright light on it and it
appears not to be a capacitor.
The top of it is jet black and about 1/8" or slightly more in diameter and
it feels like metal. Then there is a black jacket surrounding it and, at the
top, it feels like plastic to my pliers. The diameter increases quickly down
from the top and it is soon about the same diameter as the capacitors near
it. Further down it appears to be harder and it is definitely distorted on a
side towards one capacitor.
Ok, I don't have a picture of the 360W but I do of the 340W
which I believe is the same design with minimal changes.
Unfortunately the wiring harness isn't pulled out of the
way, but I "think" I may have one of these still because it
had to be repaired (different problem, power surge blew out
a high voltage transistor). picture is ~ 500KB

http://69.36.166.207/usr_1034/HPC-340_enlight_highpower_sirtec.jpg

If yours is like this and you can indicate on the picture
where it is, I can check the one I have here. Maybe your
description is dead-on, that it's a cap, but I had doubts
because of the way you worded it and a bad cap generally
stays round while there are definitely a few inductors
around these capacitors and they're roughly the same size.
All the caps have aluminum colored metal tops while the
inductors will have black tops. Well, all the caps except
any which have vented out the top which will look more tan
or darkish crusty colored. For example,
http://www.jebswebsite.com/misc_pics/ibm_mobo_capacitors.jpg
Click to expand...

I have not seen any electronic component like it, so I can't say whether it
is an inductor or not.
The only markings I can see on it is 25 at the top. If I took the platform
with the components out, I might get more info.
Unless a capacitor has a defective top vent and is cemented
down at the base (in which case they may completely explode
leaving what looks like shards of paper and foil all over,
usually shutting down the PSU completely), the two main
visual cues are that it has slanted at a funny angle with
the rubber plug on the bottom extended out of the metal
casing, or the flat top has bulged outwards in a dome shape,
and of course electrolyte leakage at the top or bottom but
that might have turned to a rough crusty looking substance
(not to be confused with the cement they used to secure
parts in place, which started out light tan or white but may
darken with time^heat..
Click to expand...

There is no trace of any chemicals from a capacitor. Apart from one side of
that black object, everything looks like new in there.
Depends on the budget, how much risk you want to take. The
cheapest thing I might try would be an Ultra V-Series 400W
or 500W, which are often nearly free after rebate at
Frys.com or Radio Shack. They aren't the best quality
though, a good median quality unit would be a
Sparkle/Fortron 350-400W but not their newest series which
have more 12V, less 5V current capacity, rather an older
model like
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817104931
(or even better, their next higher wattage unit isn't just
worth 50W more, it has a better build quality too
(FSP400-60PFN)

If you wanted to reuse the psu you buy with your next system
upgrade, instead of these you should be looking at a high
wattage modern PSU - but unless your next system is very
power hungry, it can practically cost as much to buy that
very high wattage PSU to get enough 5V current, as it would
for a more normal wattage for your present system then again
Click to expand...

Thanks Kony for the suggestions.
Yes, you would want a more modern PSU optimized towards
supplying more 12V current to power that, not your Enlight
and not the Sparkle/Fortrons I mentioned above. In other
words, this board would not need anywhere near the suggested
200W of combined 3.3V+5V power, but ideally you would shoot
for a PSU trusted to be able to provide at least 14-16A of
12V power (even more if running a lot of hard drives or a
higher powered gaming video card). Typically for a modern
system 18A @ 12V is considered median value and a little
Click to expand...

I just visited Enlight:
http://us.enlightcorp.com/Product/Product_Detail.aspx?ID=48

and found the following data, which agrees with your recent comments:

ATX 2.0 400W 120mm Fan
The combined power on +5V & +3.3V: 140W max
The combined power on +5V, +3.3V, +12V1 & +12V2: 390W max

On the 360W Enlight I have

EN-8361934 (Model HPC-360-102) 360W PSU,

DC output: +5V x 35A. +3.3V x 28A = 220W.
DC output: 12V x 17A. = 204W.

Notice how the output has been considerably downgraded for the 5 and 3.3V.

This evening, with the 250W PSU in place, I added a new Bios battery,
downgraded the FSB to 200, shorted out the Bios and removed the second HD.
The only drive attached to the board was the HD. I removed the hefty
Gigabyte video card and installed a very slimmed down AGP card. Then I
started it and ran it for about 30 seconds. No beeps and no attempt to boot.
I will try a video PCI card tomorrow.
If you happened to have soldering skills and it is a bad cap
in your psu, you might just consider replacing the cap(s).
Takes about a half hour to disassemble and do it (and you'd
need a beefy soldering iron, in case they've flooded the
bottom of the board with solder as I don't recall this
aspect on the Enlights).
Click to expand...

I can solder and I have a hefty iron but I would need to find the faulty
part replacement first.
First step, the indentification.

Thanks again Kony. You have been great support.

RF
 
So it looks like a dead capacitor and a dead PSU. Can you recommend a
The following comes from: http://www.directron.com/psu.html

"Based on the above criteria and our general experience in return rates,
these are consistently high quality brands on the market: EnerMax, Delta, PC
Power & Cooling, Enhance, Antec, CWT, and SPI. These brands are consistently
associated with low-eight models: L&C, Deer, Skyhawk, Star, KME, KingStar,
and LCT."

I have had several PC Power and Cooling and Antec PSUs and had no
complaints.

RF
 
The following comes from: http://www.directron.com/psu.html

"Based on the above criteria and our general experience in return rates,
these are consistently high quality brands on the market: EnerMax, Delta, PC
Power & Cooling, Enhance, Antec, CWT, and SPI. These brands are consistently
associated with low-eight models: L&C, Deer, Skyhawk, Star, KME, KingStar,
and LCT."

I have had several PC Power and Cooling and Antec PSUs and had no
complaints.
Click to expand...


Their list is fairly true but some brands do have problems
from time to time with specific models and above all the
criteria should be;

1) Name brand you trust. Many of the major PSU
manufacturers build to different price points, make some low
end units that may be intended for inclusion "free with
case" for case manufacturers. That there is a retail
presence for separate PSU at all is evidence enough that
came-with-case PSU are often inadequate.

2) Rated for the amount of current your system needs, plus
some reserve. Since the A7N8X uses very little 12V current,
it mainly being used by the hard drives and gaming video
card if present, the typical PSU best for the system (more
cost effective) would not be claiming very high 12V current
(generally under 20A) but around 30A of 5V current or the
aforementioned 200W+ of combined 3.3V+5V current (the
combined rating has historically been a better indicator
than the seemingly more direct 5V current rating because it
hasn't been used as much as an optimistic peak/momentary
current as a real gauge of what the 5V rail can sustain for
awhile.

For example, some CWT are pretty good but others wearing
very similar labels and ratings are built to a far lower
price point for OEM inclusion with cases. The latter weigh
a lot less so (if I remember correctly) the statement on
Directron's site about weight being an indicator is somewhat
true though still a fairly crude gauge that can't indicate
certain kinds of problems like inferior capacitors that
weigh as much as their better counterparts.

For the later Athlon XP systems using a lot of 5V current
I've had the best results using some OEM Delta PSU (not
typically available at retail and cost either a lot when
found designated for servers or are a steal when found as
surplus), and the Sparkle/Fortron (SPI) FSP400-60PFN. There
are plenty of other PSU which would be sufficient too, it
depends a bit on how long you need this system to run
considering it's now aged. In other words some factors that
effect lifespan of a PSU might matter more when making a
selection for a brand new system than for one already a few
years old that might not need nor warrant as much money
spent for longevity.
 
kony said:
Their list is fairly true but some brands do have problems
from time to time with specific models and above all the
criteria should be;

1) Name brand you trust. Many of the major PSU
manufacturers build to different price points, make some low
end units that may be intended for inclusion "free with
case" for case manufacturers. That there is a retail
presence for separate PSU at all is evidence enough that
came-with-case PSU are often inadequate.

2) Rated for the amount of current your system needs, plus
some reserve. Since the A7N8X uses very little 12V current,
it mainly being used by the hard drives and gaming video
card if present, the typical PSU best for the system (more
cost effective) would not be claiming very high 12V current
(generally under 20A) but around 30A of 5V current or the
aforementioned 200W+ of combined 3.3V+5V current (the
combined rating has historically been a better indicator
than the seemingly more direct 5V current rating because it
hasn't been used as much as an optimistic peak/momentary
current as a real gauge of what the 5V rail can sustain for
awhile.

For example, some CWT are pretty good but others wearing
very similar labels and ratings are built to a far lower
price point for OEM inclusion with cases. The latter weigh
a lot less so (if I remember correctly) the statement on
Directron's site about weight being an indicator is somewhat
true though still a fairly crude gauge that can't indicate
certain kinds of problems like inferior capacitors that
weigh as much as their better counterparts.

For the later Athlon XP systems using a lot of 5V current
I've had the best results using some OEM Delta PSU (not
typically available at retail and cost either a lot when
found designated for servers or are a steal when found as
surplus), and the Sparkle/Fortron (SPI) FSP400-60PFN. There
are plenty of other PSU which would be sufficient too, it
depends a bit on how long you need this system to run
considering it's now aged. In other words some factors that
effect lifespan of a PSU might matter more when making a
selection for a brand new system than for one already a few
years old that might not need nor warrant as much money
spent for longevity.
Click to expand...

At the present time, I have serious doubts about whether the ASUS is
"alive," so I am trying to aim at a PSU that would run the ASUS or the
Intel. Antec has a much better range of products than PC P & P.

They also have a few older types, like the PP 403X where the 3.3 and 5V have
245W max.

On the other hand, they have a 430W Neo HE 430 that has about 140W for 3.3
and 5 and 380 for 12V.

One question in a FAQ on their website asks about the 5 V rail. The answer
said that Intel had removed it from their specs. Seems like the low voltage
stuff is getting the boot.

It amazes me how Apple managed to get their whole MAC OSX into a space that
is about the same size as one of these power supplies. Are we PC people the
gas guzzlers of the computer world?

Antec has a "Green" EarthWatts line with a 430W unit at:

http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=27430

Apparently they are certified as 80%+ efficient. The best local price for
this is about $65 and I am interested.

All other lines have very detailed specs but this one is very short of them.
I'm looking for them at present.

Thanks again Kony for your patience. You are truly a mine of information :-)

RF
 
At the present time, I have serious doubts about whether the ASUS is
"alive," so I am trying to aim at a PSU that would run the ASUS or the
Intel. Antec has a much better range of products than PC P & P.
Click to expand...

.... but PC P&C has much better products than Antec. Antec
isn't junk but built to a midrange standard for most models.

To get both the high 5V capacity and high 12V capacity to
run either/both motherboards, you'll need a fairly high
wattage PSU and to carefully read the specs for the PSU
since a lot of them don't have much 3.3V+5V capacity these
days even in the 500W models.

They also have a few older types, like the PP 403X where the 3.3 and 5V have
245W max.
Click to expand...

Yes that would be a pretty good match for the A7N8X, though
it might've had marginal capacitors that worked ok when new
but didn't like to run hot long term.

On the other hand, they have a 430W Neo HE 430 that has about 140W for 3.3
and 5 and 380 for 12V.
Click to expand...

That would be better for the Intel board.
One question in a FAQ on their website asks about the 5 V rail. The answer
said that Intel had removed it from their specs. Seems like the low voltage
stuff is getting the boot.
Click to expand...

Intel just made the switch to (recommending) powering their
processors from the 12V rail before AMD did. Plus, AMD for
awhile seemed to want to support legacy tech more, notice
how they also didn't jump on board for BTX, made faster
processors for (super) socket 7 when Intel was moving to
socket 370, and kept using socket A for quite a long time.

It amazes me how Apple managed to get their whole MAC OSX into a space that
is about the same size as one of these power supplies. Are we PC people the
gas guzzlers of the computer world?
Click to expand...

A few years back PCChips made a "BookPC" that was far
smaller than just about anything else (ignoring specialized
industrial PCs and single board computers) and they didn't
sell so well due to performance and feature limitations
(plus being from PCChips, they were also failure-prone
junk).

As far as the gas guzzler equivalent, most MACs aren't that
small either. I wouldn't want to have one system so
feature-limited so if I had a Mac Mini I'd not replace a
primary system, rather one more addt'l system.

Antec has a "Green" EarthWatts line with a 430W unit at:

http://www.antec.com/us/productDetails.php?ProdID=27430

Apparently they are certified as 80%+ efficient. The best local price for
this is about $65 and I am interested.
Click to expand...

It's combined 3.3V+5V is 130W, inappropriate for the A7N8X.

All other lines have very detailed specs but this one is very short of them.
I'm looking for them at present.
Click to expand...

See the "Specifications" tab on Newegg's product page,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371006

and Newegg's picture of the label for the 3V+5V 130W rating.
Even the EarthWatts 500W isn't going to cut it for the
A7N8X.

This Antec is a little closer at 152W combined 3V+5V plus
enough 12V current for a typical modern system (unless you'd
add a high powered video card),
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817371004

This one's 180W of 3V+5V, getting closer to the goal...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817103937
.... but note it's $80 or so delivered. For a little under
$60 you could still have 180W combined without giving up a
reasonable 12V capacity,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817103027
 
kony said:
... but PC P&C has much better products than Antec. Antec
isn't junk but built to a midrange standard for most models.

To get both the high 5V capacity and high 12V capacity to
run either/both motherboards, you'll need a fairly high
wattage PSU and to carefully read the specs for the PSU
since a lot of them don't have much 3.3V+5V capacity these
days even in the 500W models.



Yes that would be a pretty good match for the A7N8X, though
it might've had marginal capacitors that worked ok when new
but didn't like to run hot long term.



That would be better for the Intel board.


Intel just made the switch to (recommending) powering their
processors from the 12V rail before AMD did. Plus, AMD for
awhile seemed to want to support legacy tech more, notice
how they also didn't jump on board for BTX, made faster
processors for (super) socket 7 when Intel was moving to
socket 370, and kept using socket A for quite a long time.



A few years back PCChips made a "BookPC" that was far
smaller than just about anything else (ignoring specialized
industrial PCs and single board computers) and they didn't
sell so well due to performance and feature limitations
(plus being from PCChips, they were also failure-prone
junk).
Click to expand...

Thanks for that education :-)
As far as the gas guzzler equivalent, most MACs aren't that
small either. I wouldn't want to have one system so
feature-limited so if I had a Mac Mini I'd not replace a
primary system, rather one more addt'l system.



It's combined 3.3V+5V is 130W, inappropriate for the A7N8X.



See the "Specifications" tab on Newegg's product page,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371006

and Newegg's picture of the label for the 3V+5V 130W rating.
Even the EarthWatts 500W isn't going to cut it for the
A7N8X.

This Antec is a little closer at 152W combined 3V+5V plus
enough 12V current for a typical modern system (unless you'd
add a high powered video card),
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16817371004

This one's 180W of 3V+5V, getting closer to the goal...
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817103937
... but note it's $80 or so delivered. For a little under
$60 you could still have 180W combined without giving up a
reasonable 12V capacity,
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817103027
Click to expand...

I'm in your debt Kony for that huge effort :-)

I have been looking in all the wrong places. So Newegg is the place to go
for specs. The local Antec is asleep.

You have persuaded me to think about the P P&C S470 ATX which has the
following
Outputs:

+5V @ 32A = 160W
+12V @ 26A = 312
-12V @ 0.8A
+3.3V @ 28A = 92
+5VSB @ 2A
continuous = 470W
peak = 520W
PFC = 0.99 ! Phew! good.

3.3 + 5V supplies 252W - great.
This should work very well for the ASUS but, info about the 12V may be
missing. It is about the 4x4 x 12V supply to the CPU. Of course, it could be
included in the 26A. I sent an email to them asking for confirmation.
If it is, the 12V supply has only 312W.
It costs about $95, incl shipping.

Thanks again Kony.

RF
 
Red Fox said:
Thanks for that education :-)


I'm in your debt Kony for that huge effort :-)

I have been looking in all the wrong places. So Newegg is the place to go
for specs. The local Antec is asleep.

You have persuaded me to think about the P P&C S470 ATX which has the
following
Outputs:

+5V @ 32A = 160W
+12V @ 26A = 312
-12V @ 0.8A
+3.3V @ 28A = 92
+5VSB @ 2A
continuous = 470W
peak = 520W
PFC = 0.99 ! Phew! good.

3.3 + 5V supplies 252W - great.
This should work very well for the ASUS but, info about the 12V may be
missing. It is about the 4x4 x 12V supply to the CPU. Of course, it could be
included in the 26A. I sent an email to them asking for confirmation.
If it is, the 12V supply has only 312W.
It costs about $95, incl shipping.
Click to expand...

I just had a reply from PC P&C and 252W is the total from the PSU. Raymond
there said that, unless one uses a "gobbler" video card, the 252 should be
adequate. I don't believe in gobblers ;-)

RF
 
Finally, I made the plunge with PCP&C's Silencer 610 EPS12V

+5V @ 30A = 150W
+12V @ 49A = 588W
-12V @ 0.8A
+3.3V @ 24A = 79W
+5VSB @ 3A
continuous = 610W
peak = 670W

That power should do anything I want to do :-)

Thanks for all the help.

RF
 
Back
Top