AMD64 and Windows CPU Usage (and temp)

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jab3

Hello everyone...

I recently replaced an old P4/MB combo with an Athlon 64 3200+ and Abit AV8
mainboard. I tried out the game I play (World of Warcraft if that's
matters) and I noticed that the CPU usage is at 100%. (The gfx card is just
an nVidia FX 5500 w/ 256MB; the system RAM is 1G) That doesn't bother me,
but I've heard that 100% CPU Usage implies a problem. And a friend of mine
(the 'Intel guy') laughed and said his P4 (~3Ghz w/ HyperThreading) runs at
45% during Warcraft. I asked about this on alt.gaming.warcraft and someone
said that a P4 w/ HT may report 50% sometimes, 100% sometimes. Why is
that? Is the processor (the P4) actually running at 100% but reporting
something else? Is HT that much better? I personally don't mind that the
CPU uses its full capacity if that's okay and normal; I don't want to
overheat the processor though. (next question) And, even though Windows
says my AMD is running at 100%, I can tab out of Warcraft and load Azureus
(Java based BitTorrent program) or Firefox and use them with no problem.
So Windows is still preempting the process when necessary, I'm assuming.
It's not like when Windows is searching for a network printer it can't find
and the processor jumps to 100% and slows the whole thing down. The game
runs fine.

Also, I noticed that after 20mins playing the temp goes to 50-C (maybe more
after hours of playing). But when not playing, it goes down to 39-40C.
How hot is too hot for an AMD?



Thanks for any help and info,
jab3
 
jab3 said:
Hello everyone...

I recently replaced an old P4/MB combo with an Athlon 64 3200+ and Abit
AV8
mainboard. I tried out the game I play (World of Warcraft if that's
matters) and I noticed that the CPU usage is at 100%. (The gfx card is
just
an nVidia FX 5500 w/ 256MB; the system RAM is 1G) That doesn't bother me,
but I've heard that 100% CPU Usage implies a problem. And a friend of
mine
(the 'Intel guy') laughed and said his P4 (~3Ghz w/ HyperThreading) runs
at
45% during Warcraft. I asked about this on alt.gaming.warcraft and
someone
said that a P4 w/ HT may report 50% sometimes, 100% sometimes. Why is
that? Is the processor (the P4) actually running at 100% but reporting
something else? Is HT that much better? I personally don't mind that the
CPU uses its full capacity if that's okay and normal; I don't want to
overheat the processor though. (next question) And, even though Windows
says my AMD is running at 100%, I can tab out of Warcraft and load Azureus
(Java based BitTorrent program) or Firefox and use them with no problem.
So Windows is still preempting the process when necessary, I'm assuming.
It's not like when Windows is searching for a network printer it can't
find
and the processor jumps to 100% and slows the whole thing down. The game
runs fine.

Also, I noticed that after 20mins playing the temp goes to 50-C (maybe
more
after hours of playing). But when not playing, it goes down to 39-40C.
How hot is too hot for an AMD?



Thanks for any help and info,
jab3
Click to expand...

The default alarm setting for my Asus K8V SE board, using a AMD 64 3000+, is
72degC if that's any use to you. Mine normally runs around 35 to 40degC but
I don't play games.
 
jab3 said:
Hello everyone...

I recently replaced an old P4/MB combo with an Athlon 64 3200+ and Abit AV8
mainboard. I tried out the game I play (World of Warcraft if that's
matters) and I noticed that the CPU usage is at 100%. (The gfx card is just
an nVidia FX 5500 w/ 256MB; the system RAM is 1G) That doesn't bother me,
but I've heard that 100% CPU Usage implies a problem. And a friend of mine
(the 'Intel guy') laughed and said his P4 (~3Ghz w/ HyperThreading) runs at
45% during Warcraft. I asked about this on alt.gaming.warcraft and someone
said that a P4 w/ HT may report 50% sometimes, 100% sometimes. Why is
that? Is the processor (the P4) actually running at 100% but reporting
something else? Is HT that much better? I personally don't mind that the
CPU uses its full capacity if that's okay and normal; I don't want to
overheat the processor though. (next question) And, even though Windows
says my AMD is running at 100%, I can tab out of Warcraft and load Azureus
(Java based BitTorrent program) or Firefox and use them with no problem.
So Windows is still preempting the process when necessary, I'm assuming.
It's not like when Windows is searching for a network printer it can't find
and the processor jumps to 100% and slows the whole thing down. The game
runs fine.

Also, I noticed that after 20mins playing the temp goes to 50-C (maybe more
after hours of playing). But when not playing, it goes down to 39-40C.
How hot is too hot for an AMD?



Thanks for any help and info,
jab3
Click to expand...

Windows XP treats HT as though there is a 2nd processor. This could be
why the usage would be at 45%. In regards to heat, the athlon runs
hotter than the P4 by design. The athlons max temperature is ~80-C (if
memory serves) and the core will melt if above that temperature. 50-C
when gaming is ok, you've still got lots of room left before you
encounter a heat problem.

Hope this helps
 
Windows XP treats HT as though there is a 2nd processor. This could be
why the usage would be at 45%. In regards to heat, the athlon runs
hotter than the P4 by design.
Click to expand...

Nope, you have that backwards. P4 at same performance level
runs hotter and has for a long time. In fact, the only time
the P4 was cool(er) enough to be worth commenting about was
before the P4 ever existed! All the ludicrous nonsense
about Athlons=hot stem from the early days when Athlon was
being contrasted against a P3 Coppermine. Only thing that
some P4 do cooler is idle, which in itself is a performance
tradeoff. Read the datasheets.
The athlons max temperature is ~80-C (if
memory serves) and the core will melt if above that temperature. 50-C
when gaming is ok, you've still got lots of room left before you
encounter a heat problem.
Click to expand...

It is not usful to try and categorize "Athlons" in this way,
especially since they (Athlon64) are the cooler running of
the two mainstream CPUs BY FAR. Even Athlon XP ran cooler
than their contemporary P4 with exception of only Palomino
cores.
 
kony said:
It is not usful to try and categorize "Athlons" in this way,
especially since they (Athlon64) are the cooler running of
the two mainstream CPUs BY FAR. Even Athlon XP ran cooler
than their contemporary P4 with exception of only Palomino
cores.
Click to expand...

So does this mean that the Athlon 64 running at 50-C while gaming is hot
(again that's only after 15mins, don't know about 3 hours)? Because my P4
friend thought it was.

I'm just using the AMD HSF that came with it.


-jab3
 
Cam wrote:

[snipped my own stuff]
Windows XP treats HT as though there is a 2nd processor. This could be
why the usage would be at 45%. In regards to heat, the athlon runs
hotter than the P4 by design. The athlons max temperature is ~80-C (if
memory serves) and the core will melt if above that temperature. 50-C
when gaming is ok, you've still got lots of room left before you
encounter a heat problem.

Hope this helps
Click to expand...

Yeah the Abit uGuru is set to shut off the CPU at 85-C and issue a warning
at 75-C. A bit after writing that I had some time to search the Net and
found that most people seem to have their Athlon run at 50-55-C while
gaming. Others were saying 60-65, but the general consensus was that 60-65
was not good. :)



-jab3
 
So does this mean that the Athlon 64 running at 50-C while gaming is hot
(again that's only after 15mins, don't know about 3 hours)? Because my P4
friend thought it was.

I'm just using the AMD HSF that came with it.


-jab3
Click to expand...

Why are we dwelling on these questions?
It's not some great mystery what an acceptible CPU temp
range is, even ignoring that anyone can download the spec
sheet and see for themselves.

The answer is that CPU temp depends on many variables
besides which CPU is used. There is no "OK" or "expected"
lone temperature, only a range. 50C is well under the
ceiling and nothing to be concerned about. FWIW, the
average/modern higher end P4 doesn't run below 50C at full
load so I don't know what your "P4 friend" was thinking,
unless as already mentioned, the other variables weren't
actaully being considered to draw the conclusion.

The heatsink supplied with the CPU is adequate.
Is the system instable? Kinda silly to go around
questioning everything on a system that DOES work ok?

On the other hand, if you want best game performance then
don't try to use the system for bittorrents simultaneously.
 
Cam wrote:

[snipped my own stuff]
Windows XP treats HT as though there is a 2nd processor. This could be
why the usage would be at 45%. In regards to heat, the athlon runs
hotter than the P4 by design. The athlons max temperature is ~80-C (if
memory serves) and the core will melt if above that temperature. 50-C
when gaming is ok, you've still got lots of room left before you
encounter a heat problem.

Hope this helps
Click to expand...

Yeah the Abit uGuru is set to shut off the CPU at 85-C and issue a warning
at 75-C. A bit after writing that I had some time to search the Net and
found that most people seem to have their Athlon run at 50-55-C while
gaming. Others were saying 60-65, but the general consensus was that 60-65
was not good. :)
Click to expand...

"Good" relative to what?
60C, _IF_ an accurate temp reading, is low enough that
any/all Athlons should be stable at stock speed. While
it's a bit far-reaching to draw a conclusion, if the CPU was
indeed instable at a known-valid 60C temp, at stock speed,
it is defective and should be exchanged for a normally
functional CPU.

Overclockers have more concerns as the temp effects how far
one can overclock. A stable system is a stable system... if
it's stable at 60C you have not gained anything by reducing
the temp to 50, 40, or even 30C. Some might argue that the
CPU will last longer, and indeed if you expect to use it 15
years from now you might have atypical concerns. Otherwise
the CPU is not really important to focus on as it is
designed to tolerate running continually at 60C. More
important might be other parts which aren't necessary
tolerant of "potential" cooling/airflow issues causing that
60C.
 
kony said:
Why are we dwelling on these questions?
Click to expand...

HA! Yeah I know man, I'm sorry. You are indeed being patient. The problem
is that I've got this guy chuckling and giggling in my ear saying that the
new AMD sux and isn't performing well and is running hot and that the P4 is
far superior because it is able (according to him now) to do the same load
at only 50% usage and cooler. So I'm thinking, if he's right then maybe I
should have bought another P4. So I'm asking on these groups to get a
broader range of input. Sorry if it's getting monotonous.

It's also that I bought this CPU from Newegg and I only have 7 days to
return it to them; otherwise I'll have to deal with AMD and I'd rather deal
with Newegg. (for whatever reasons....I'm sure AMD customer service would
be fine)

It's not some great mystery what an acceptible CPU temp
range is, even ignoring that anyone can download the spec
sheet and see for themselves.

The answer is that CPU temp depends on many variables
besides which CPU is used. There is no "OK" or "expected"
lone temperature, only a range. 50C is well under the
ceiling and nothing to be concerned about. FWIW, the
average/modern higher end P4 doesn't run below 50C at full
load so I don't know what your "P4 friend" was thinking,
unless as already mentioned, the other variables weren't
actaully being considered to draw the conclusion.

The heatsink supplied with the CPU is adequate.
Is the system instable? Kinda silly to go around
questioning everything on a system that DOES work ok?
Click to expand...

Yeah I know. There were some problems with the game (rebooting or
freezing), but it seems to be that some of the video options I had turned
up (anisotropic filtering was probably one) were causing the system hangs.
My friend has everything turned up on his and the game and computer runs
fine, but I believe that's because the graphics card he has is better.
He's got a Dell 4700 (Dimension I assume) that came with a 128MB-ATI Radeon
(not sure which, but newer). I've got this semi-older nVidia FX 5500 but
with 256MB gfx memory. We each have 1G RAM. But of course he's trying to
say the P4 has something to do with it.
On the other hand, if you want best game performance then
don't try to use the system for bittorrents simultaneously.
Click to expand...

I don't. I tabbed out and loaded Azureus because I wanted something that
was resource hungry (at least a little) and I've noticed in the past that
since Azureus is java-based, the java module takes some RAM, so I just
figured if that would load and run then the processor/WinXP was doing ok.
(Granted the java program only uses up about 32M of memory, but it was the
first thing I could think of that would use more than Firefox)


Thanks for your patience with my persistence/stubbornness.


-jab3
 
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